Does it REALLY work??

[jack1ynn]

I'm just curious as to whether or not hypnotherapy really works?
I have VERY bad anxiety and panic attacks. As well as a phobia of vomitting and being sick that pretty much affects my life every day.
Counselors...doctors...all that crap hasn't helped and I've been desperately looking for something that will help.
I'm very interested in hypnotherapy.
But from everything I've read on message boards and stuff...doesn't seem to work as well as it's "said" to.
At this point I kind of see hypnotherapy as a "too good to be true" kind of thing.
Also as like those work at home and make 5 billion dollars schemes.

So my question is....does it actually work??
And if it does, in which ways does it work?
If I were to go for anxiety and phobias and such, what should I expect?
I don't want to have unrealistic expectations of having complete relief of my fears and stresses and worries if that isn't the case.

Pretty much the only things that I've read where people have actually been helped is for things like quitting smoking...weight loss...insomnia.

So....anybody?

[skip]

jack,

Yes it works.

It works for all sorts of things including but not limited to the things you mentioned as problems you are having.

It is fast, and the results are long lasting.

Seek out a qualified hypnotherapast and go.

And if it takes a little travel to find a good one, thats ok, just consider what it is going to be worth being free of the things you described.

skip

[jack1ynn]

Thank you. :)

Is there anything I need to know when looking for a good hypnotherapist?
I'm new to it all so I get so confused when looking.
Some charge an arm and a leg and look and talk as if they don't really know what they're talking about.
And some are cheap..but seem alright.
Money is tight...so I don't want to spend hundreds and hundreds just trying to find a decent one ya know?
And most that I've seen don't really let you meet with them and discuss anything whatsoever without paying them first.

[skip]

Most will give you a free evaluation consultation.

Charging is realtive, an arm and a leg is a mere pittance compared with continuing wirth a problem for the rest of your life.

But that is your decision.

The only relavant thing is do you get what you wanted from the sessions.

If you will tell us where you live, we (collectively) might know someone reputable close by whom we could recommend.

skip

[Henrik]

Hi, jack1ynn.

You could ask potential hypnotherapists/NLPers:

1. How long have you been in practice. Is this you "real" job or are you actually a plumber who also do some part-time therapy...
2. What is your schooling. Who have thaught you.
3. Are you specializing in anything in particular? What?
4. How many clients have you had (the last X years)? What is your success rate?
5. Have you had clients with similar issues to me? How many? What is your success rate?
6. What are the tools you're using? NLP, hypnotherapy, Timeline work, PEAT, Gnostics, Aspectics, energy psychologies like EFT...
7. How many sessions do you think I need? Why do you think that?
8. If using hypnotherapy, do you use any form of hypnotic convincers?
9. Do you have a money back guarantee.

I'm sure you can come up with other questions as well.

"And most that I've seen don't really let you meet with them and discuss anything whatsoever without paying them first."

If they don't let you ask questions like some of the ones above when you call them I would move on to the next one.

As it happens, many of the regulars on this forum are skilled therapists. The man who first answered your reply is one. So depending on where you live you might be able to find someone who can help you right here. Poodle also seems to know a therapist or two in most corners of the world. She might be able to help you find one.

Henrik

[jack1ynn]

Most will give you a free evaluation consultation.

Charging is realtive, an arm and a leg is a mere pittance compared with continuing wirth a problem for the rest of your life.

But that is your decision.

The only relavant thing is do you get what you wanted from the sessions.

If you will tell us where you live, we (collectively) might know someone reputable close by whom we could recommend.

skip

Makes sense! :o)
I live in Tempe, AZ

[jack1ynn]

Hi, jack1ynn.

You could ask potential hypnotherapists/NLPers:

1. How long have you been in practice. Is this you "real" job or are you actually a plumber who also do some part-time therapy...
2. What is your schooling. Who have thaught you.
3. Are you specializing in anything in particular? What?
4. How many clients have you had (the last X years)? What is your success rate?
5. Have you had clients with similar issues to me? How many? What is your success rate?
6. What are the tools you're using? NLP, hypnotherapy, Timeline work, PEAT, Gnostics, Aspectics, energy psychologies like EFT...
7. How many sessions do you think I need? Why do you think that?
8. If using hypnotherapy, do you use any form of hypnotic convincers?
9. Do you have a money back guarantee.

I'm sure you can come up with other questions as well.

"And most that I've seen don't really let you meet with them and discuss anything whatsoever without paying them first."

If they don't let you ask questions like some of the ones above when you call them I would move on to the next one.

As it happens, many of the regulars on this forum are skilled therapists. The man who first answered your reply is one. So depending on where you live you might be able to find someone who can help you right here. Poodle also seems to know a therapist or two in most corners of the world. She might be able to help you find one.

Henrik


Thanks a ton. :)

[Terry]

I am a person who is continually seeking knowledge, and you can provide me with information I am curious about.
Why would a person come online to a board dedicated to a subject, and ask "Does it work"? Seems to me, that if it didn;t work we would all be con artist and of course reply that it did. Seems to me also that your question is an insult, at least to me, so I am giving you the opportunity to inform me as to why you asked as you did?

[jack1ynn]

Well I apologize if my wording offended you. I think everyone on this forum has different levels in their seriousness of the topic.
Pretty much...I came on this board because all I was finding online was testimonials from hypnotherapy websites...hypnotherapist websites actually.
My thinking is...stay away from those testimonials. Because ofcourse they'd all be good. And since it's THEIR website...it could also be made up. Nobody actually knows.
I know little to nothing about the topic.
Which is why I came here...or found it actually.
I was ill last night. Which made me have panic attacks all night. I felt like I was losing my mind and I ended up extremely depressed and just miserable. Seeing as how I go through this time after time, always going in circles. Trying to find help from doctors, medications, counselors. Which none of them helped at all. Someone mentioned hypnotherapy and I got excited thinking there was possibly another option for me.
I don't think there is a single person who automatically believes something. Especially without questioning it.
I did come across a few other message boards. Where people stated that hypnotherapy didn't help them at all. And that all it felt like was a little nap.
This worried me because a) I am a stay at home mom, so I have no income. And b) my childs father just lost his job.
Needing help when you have no money at all is horrible. But needing the help badly enough that you'd try to borrow money from parents and such, it isn't exactly something you just want to throw money away at. Especially when the money can be going to putting food on the table.
I however felt that it was necessary and wanted to give it a shot.
But I did NOT want to go into it blindly and get excited about something I knew little about.
So I came on this forum seeing that there were a TON of members. OBVIOUSLY someone had to have been hypnotized before and would be able to tell me if it worked for them and if they got good results.
Which was my reasoning for asking.
Going online to see people who arent certified and only doing it for a year or two and charging $500 is scary.
You really need to be sure what you're getting into. I needed to be sure what I was getting into.
To be honest I myself am insulted that you feel you need to take your time to tell me that you need an explanation from me. Which honestly I don't need to give explanations or reasoning for my questions or why I came to this board.
If you take this THAT seriously, to the point where you need to be rude, something is wrong. Especially when my post was harmless and not meant to cause any trouble.
I hope I cleared that up for you and you can rest well tonight after my explanation to you.
I came to this forum because I'm trying to get help for myself.

[Poodle]

I had one on the phone for two hours before she bothered to ask my prices only to find out she could not afford it. I asked if she had health insurance and she replied yes so she got sent to traditional therapy and was thrilled to go back to it. "Oh yes, I was better when in there."

[jack1ynn]

Haha ouch.
I think price is usually the first thing I ask.
Otherwise it just wastes time for both people. And you can't exactly do anything without the cash!

[Terry]

First of all, I was not rude, I asked a question, and your reply was not a reply but an excuse. I will therefor assume that your insult was due to ignorance of language.
You say you are finding persons who charge $500. after only a few years in business, I would like to know whom you are reffering to, since I don;t know of any of them, and I have been in this business for forty years, so pray do tell?... I did say I was a curous person after all.....
Yes I know some who charge much more, but they have been around for more than a few years, and what they charge is their business. I also know many who charge half that price and are highly skilled so my interest is aroused again. I even know some who do pro bono work via doctors refferals, so it would seem that cost has no bearing on skill level. Many of us do work with those who have nothing, but we have no desire to waste our time either, and to date you have not asked any question that would lead to you being helped or advised. Fact is you have only complained and that is ineffective......

[jack1ynn]

Well I seemed to think my question was pretty simple. And not very hard to understand.
I asked if hypnotherapy had worked for anyone else.
So I don't know what YOU are talking about.

And I'm pretty sure I also gave you a very detailed explanation of why I came to this forum asking what I had asked. Even repeated myself a couple times also.

If you are trying to imply that you are in some way superior to me...get over yourself. ;) And I am very intelligent thank you very much.

I did not come here being mean to anybody...I did not ask ridiculous questions. And I did not come here to argue with people.
Unlike you, I am capable of understanding that obviously there are people like yourself that have their lives revolve around this stuff and have probably been into it for years. And there are people like me who simply just want to know about it and know how/if it works to know if it is something they want to get into.
The more you talk the more it just makes me believe that you are asking questions and saying the things you do because you are actually pissed that I even asked if it worked.
And if that is the case then I'd have to say that you have the wrong job, especially since you're dealing with people. If you're incapable of understanding that a LOT of people know very little about this kind of stuff because NOT very many people actually do it...so they ARE going to ask if it actually works.
Especially when all they've really been exposed to is fun little shows where people are hypnotized to run around like monkeys or to try and take off the shirt of the person sitting next to them.
Now...if you only have seen shows like that, and you heard that hypnotherapy can be used to help with problems that you have..wouldn't you question it???
Which is EXACTLY why I came here and asked. To find out if it has worked for anyone and if anyone has had success with it.
I've been doing my own research trying to find someone who a) is good at what they do and b) doesn't cost an extreme amount of money. I never said that the more you pay the better and more skilled the person is. I'm sure there ARE some good ones out there who would work with me and arent really expensive. But I was simply saying that there are also people out there who don't have any clue what they are doing...try to make you THINK that they know what they're doing..and cost an unreasonable amount of money.
I've been looking, I've emailed and called quite a few. So I'm sure I would know.
You seem very arrogant. I'm surprised you actually "help" people.
The others on this site have been a lot more nice and helpful than you. Maybe you should learn something.
And maybe you shouldn't be so curious...

[Connie]

Jack, your name is half right. And why you came here is utterly transparent.

[jack1ynn]

Jack, your name is half right. And why you came here is utterly transparent.

No, why I came here is simple and not hard to understand. ;o) To know if people have had success with it. Go to other message boards..read what they had to say. If you knew nothing, and were looking for answers...you'd want as many REAL personal experiences and stories as possible...good or bad.
If you are saying that because I was argueing with someone else...well then you failed to see that I felt very insulted and felt they were being rude to me for no reason.

After I came to this board it because obvious that there were actual people who do this as a job. And I meant no disrespect to anyone by questioning it. Still to this day there are people who even question if God exists. So the fact that someone would question if hypnotherapy has worked for people isn't exactly something that people should get all offended about.
I HAVE recently talked to people who shouldn't be having a career in hypnotherapy. And just like doctors...psychiatrists..and everything else, there ARE people who are fakes and dont know what they are doing. That is life.
When I said what I said...I don't know WHY it was taken the way it was, unless people feel insecure about their abilities and what they are doing for a living. Then I can understand getting offended and wanting to be rude. However, if that's what I meant...then I'd have a twisted way of thinking and that woud be like me saying that all doctors are idiots and don't know what they are doing.
And I've had good and bad doctors. It depends on the person.
I'm pretty sure that someone who practices hypnotherapy would know that...and wouldn't assume that every other person that does it is a genious and is amazing at what they do. Therefore they wouldn't be offended, and would know what I was saying.
And as for my comment about me feeling like it was like a work at home scam. I spent the past couple days googling almost every hypnotherapist in my city, talking to them, emailing them, and checking out their sites. Almost all of them make you feel like one session will make your life perfect and you'd be cured forever. After dealing with serious issues. You have to wonder if it's possible.
Which is why I said it seems too good to be true, and why I was curious and wanted to know if it had worked for anyone.

I didn't come here to cause drama as you seem to think. I came here seriously and honestly wanting to know if it really worked and if anyone had any success with it.
In all honesty I thought after making the post that I would get responses from people who have had it done, and would be able to tell me their experience with it. And quite honestly I was actually excited to find out. Besides hearing stories of it not working, I've heard good stories also. I was trying to see what there was more of and what I should look for.
After having these problems since I was 8 years old...I don't think you can comprehend my excitement and anxiousness to find out of hypnotherapy was really something that could help me with what I have suffered through most of my life.
So EXCUSE me for coming to a site called "HypnosisForum.com" to see if it has actually worked for people or not and if it was all real. I heard about this for the first time just a few days ago.
However I'm not going to come on here and ask what to me, is a normal harmless question. Just to be disrespected. It's uncalled for...and I don't tolerate it. Computer or not. I would never tolerate a person being rude to my face, why would I over the internet? People they can be bold just because they are safe behind their computer screen. I see it no different as if I'm talking to them face to face. And I expect respect. I treat people the way they treat me. And that person was very ****y and rude, I don't find that acceptable...sorry.

And my name is Jacklynn btw. Not Jack. ..cute though. ;)

[Don]

Hi, Jacklynn.

Unfortunately, a little information can be "dangerous," and most people get their little bit of information about hypnosis from movies and novels, all of which give an incorrect or incomplete notion of what hypnosis is. As a result, when some people ask questions based on that partial knowledge, as I suspect you may have done, it can seem quite insulting.

"Does it work?" is sort of like going to an auto mechanic and asking if they're frauds just ripping people off.

I'm going to assume that was not your intent, and I'm sharing this so you can understand why some of the professionals here--dedicated individuals who have been helping others for years or even decades--might feel insulted, even if, as I wrote, that was not your intent.

I think you are wise to doubt all of the sites with carloads of persons giving their testimony. IMO that's more like a religious site than a site focused on helping people!

So to answer your question: the American Medical Association, the British Medical Association, and the American Psychological Association all accept hypnotherapy as being an effective technique. It can be especially good for working with this such as depression, panic attacks, etc.

However, in the U.S., hypnotherapy is not licensed. Since you say you have "panic attacks" and "depression," either you are using the terms as a non-professional or you have been diagnosed with those behaviors. If you have been diagnosed, talk to your physician and get a referral. It's quite possible that your physician, therapist, psychologist, or psychiatrist know someone who can help you.

However, if you have not been diagnosed, and your self-diagnosis is what you're describing, I hope you understand that your self-diagnosis may not be correct--it could be superficial or hiding something deeper. In which case, go to a trained and experienced hypnotherapist. They should be able to help you.

Our forums have not attracted a bunch of people who come here again and again to say who wonderful their results with hypnotherapy have been. Rather, we get people who look for advice and encouragement as to whether they should get hypnotherapy. Some return after having hypnotherapy to describe how they have changed. Others do not. Such is the internet.

Nobody is going to try and fake you out here. We don't have any shills. The truth is, we have professionals here who have successfully aided people with your described behaviors for years. My suggestion is to find a hypnotherapist near you and talk with them. If you like them and get a "good feeling" about them, make an introductory appointment to talk with them and ask if they think they can help you change to the way you'd like to be.

Good luck!

[Poodle]

Yes, I can name two in Arizona to whom I would go. One is an instructor for NGH so should not be hard to find and the other is doing coaching work. You can probably find her by logging on to ngh@ngh.net There is a trainer that goes to AZ and his prices are quite reasonable IMHO. I charge much more than he does or he has not updated the website. Our own Docresults here can pull rabbits out of hats for phone work and Skip is mighty handy with phone work too. I just don't know if either of the two are taking new people right now. I personally would have no problem with any of these people. Candace at ABH is building a new website with everyone's names and contact numbers.

There is a good start for you.

And you want to know does hypnosis work: Examples: I removed cancer a year ago last Jan. with a suggestion from Terry. I also use hypnosis to replace Western medicine drugs. I use hypnosis to keep blood pressure perfectly maintained. Don has done some fantastic self-hypnosis work on himself and Connie is just a fraction of what she used to be but with a totally new and wonderful attitude and career filled with endless possibilities. Recently working with people with brain injuries we have eliminated depression, insomnia, lack of short term memory and created new neural pathways in the brain so things do work very well. Addictions are a cakewalk. Yesterday also took care of a bladder control problem. I would say it works very well.

Be well,
Pood

(That's also what I thought after she had wasted two plus hours of my time) I do freebies but they are to organizations and people of my choice.

[jack1ynn]

Yes, I can name two in Arizona to whom I would go. One is an instructor for NGH so should not be hard to find and the other is doing coaching work. You can probably find her by logging on to ngh@ngh.net There is a trainer that goes to AZ and his prices are quite reasonable IMHO. I charge much more than he does or he has not updated the website. Our own Docresults here can pull rabbits out of hats for phone work and Skip is mighty handy with phone work too. I just don't know if either of the two are taking new people right now. I personally would have no problem with any of these people. Candace at ABH is building a new website with everyone's names and contact numbers.

There is a good start for you.

Be well,
Pood

(That's also what I thought after she had wasted two plus hours of my time) I do freebies but they are to organizations and people of my choice.


Thank you. I'll check em out! :)

[jack1ynn]

Thank you so much for your reply. Seriously! haha
See...if someone would have said all of that long ago, it probably would have made more sense.
Instead I start feeling attacked and thinking "What in the world did I do wrong!?!"
I think I was just wondering if anyone had actually had good results from hypnotherapy..and then was going to go from there on what I wanted to do. So I tried to keep my first post simple and not ask a ridiculous amount of questions. hah
All of my "problems" have been diagnosed already. Not sure where all of the problems came from, or even if the person who diagnosed me was correct. But pretty much I've been seen and diagnosed already. Got that part out of the way. hah
Thanks again for your reply...and especially explaining what the heck was going on and being so kind about it. ;)

[Docresults]

"What in the world did I do wrong!?!"
I think I was just wondering if anyone had actually had good results from hypnotherapy..and then was going to go from there on what I wanted to do.

Dear Jacklynn,

Consider this please, not as an attack but only as an observation. OK?

Earlier I believe you wrote that you didn't trust the sites with testimonials of people being hypnotized and then you come here and ask if anyone had actually had good results from hypnotherapy? (In other words even though you don't trust testimonials that is what you asked for.) Could not the same parameters for not trusting the other sites be applied here as well?

How do you determine what is trustworthy and what isn't? I know they are different feelings and is it a voice or a picture inside you that tells you the difference?

To Your Best,
Doc

[jack1ynn]

Dear Jacklynn,

Consider this please, not as an attack but only as an observation. OK?

Earlier I believe you wrote that you didn't trust the sites with testimonials of people being hypnotized and then you come here and ask if anyone had actually had good results from hypnotherapy? (In other words even though you don't trust testimonials that is what you asked for.) Could not the same parameters for not trusting the other sites be applied here as well?

How do you determine what is trustworthy and what isn't? I know they are different feelings and is it a voice or a picture inside you that tells you the difference?

To Your Best,
Doc


Well...see I question almost everything I get into to ensure that I'm making right decisions and doing what I think is right..
They way I see the hypnotherapy sites...is that they are the actual hypnotherapists websites...their OWN websites. Just because they have a website doesn't actually mean they are good at what they do. They just have a website. As far as their testimonials go...There was not one bad one on ANY site. Only good ones with people saying how amazing it was. So it makes me think....some of those hypnotherapists could have made up those testimonials themselves...OR only added the ones that they felt would make them look good. Why would they ever put a BAD testimonial on their site. Does that make sense? hehe I'm trying to explain my thinking as best as possible.
So anyways...that makes me question it and want to know a little bit more.
I am cautious because I have fell for MANY things in the past and got my hopes up for things and been disappointed...and ripped off of a lot of money. So I try to be as careful as possible.
Thats why I wanted to stay away from the testimonials on hypnotherapists sites. And try to search a little bit harder to find message boards and such of people who have seen people for hypnotherapy to know what their experience was. Because more often than not, those people will be honest about their experience and you can actually talk to them about their experience. Rather than reading a 3 sentence testimonial (That could possibly not even be real).
The other message boards I had been to were boards for all different kinds of topics. So the amount of people who had done hypnotherapy was very little. And I didn't want to base anything off of just what a couple people have said. Which is why I came here because I figured a lot more people would have experience with it.
People are going to have good and bad experiences with anything. So I take what people say about it with a grain of salt. People with "bad" experiences are more likely to try and convince you that you will also have some bad experience. Like how many times have you heard people say "Be careful...sometimes it can make you worse than you already were"
So I don't take what people say too seriously, but I do like to know their story and what happened to make them have that experience.
But if more people have said they've actually gotten some help from it...then obviously it is worth considering.
Before coming to this board...the majority of the comments I'd read from people were negative about hypnotherapy. And only a handful were good. So I wanted more.
It also has a lot to do about the fact that I am extremely new to hypnotherapy. I like to try and learn as much as I can about something before I do it. And one way I try to learn is by hearing other peoples experiences.
I mean heck, when I got pregnant with my son...for 9 months I spend almost every day/all day just reading and researching every topic one by one about pregnancy and breastfeeding and newborns and toddlers. I wanted to know it all.
I like to know what I'm doing and getting into. hehe
I hope that explains it a little bit for you. :)

[skip]

Jack1ynn,

I would add one thing to what has been said.

Every professional I know has a sliding scale of pricing.

I charge anywhere from $0.00 to well you probably wouldnt believe the high end.

Sometimes I barter for work that I need done.

Virtually everyone who enters into this profession, has a genuine desire to help people, and that doesnt just mean people with the requisite pockets.

Contact these folks, tell them your situation, offer to work it off somehow.

Are you a good cook?

Can you do interior painting?

How about, "Ill drag 10 of my friends to you in the next year."; if nothing else comes to mind.

Allow yourself to be a little creative and it will allow the person you want to help you to be creative as well.

skip

[jack1ynn]

Well...see I question almost everything I get into to ensure that I'm making right decisions and doing what I think is right..
They way I see the hypnotherapy sites...is that they are the actual hypnotherapists websites...their OWN websites. Just because they have a website doesn't actually mean they are good at what they do. They just have a website. As far as their testimonials go...There was not one bad one on ANY site. Only good ones with people saying how amazing it was. So it makes me think....some of those hypnotherapists could have made up those testimonials themselves...OR only added the ones that they felt would make them look good. Why would they ever put a BAD testimonial on their site. Does that make sense? hehe I'm trying to explain my thinking as best as possible.
So anyways...that makes me question it and want to know a little bit more.
I am cautious because I have fell for MANY things in the past and got my hopes up for things and been disappointed...and ripped off of a lot of money. So I try to be as careful as possible.
Thats why I wanted to stay away from the testimonials on hypnotherapists sites. And try to search a little bit harder to find message boards and such of people who have seen people for hypnotherapy to know what their experience was. Because more often than not, those people will be honest about their experience and you can actually talk to them about their experience. Rather than reading a 3 sentence testimonial (That could possibly not even be real).
The other message boards I had been to were boards for all different kinds of topics. So the amount of people who had done hypnotherapy was very little. And I didn't want to base anything off of just what a couple people have said. Which is why I came here because I figured a lot more people would have experience with it.
People are going to have good and bad experiences with anything. So I take what people say about it with a grain of salt. People with "bad" experiences are more likely to try and convince you that you will also have some bad experience. Like how many times have you heard people say "Be careful...sometimes it can make you worse than you already were"
So I don't take what people say too seriously, but I do like to know their story and what happened to make them have that experience.
But if more people have said they've actually gotten some help from it...then obviously it is worth considering.
Before coming to this board...the majority of the comments I'd read from people were negative about hypnotherapy. And only a handful were good. So I wanted more.
It also has a lot to do about the fact that I am extremely new to hypnotherapy. I like to try and learn as much as I can about something before I do it. And one way I try to learn is by hearing other peoples experiences.
I mean heck, when I got pregnant with my son...for 9 months I spend almost every day/all day just reading and researching every topic one by one about pregnancy and breastfeeding and newborns and toddlers. I wanted to know it all.
I like to know what I'm doing and getting into. hehe
I hope that explains it a little bit for you. :)


Haha I had to add on to my comment.
When I made the comment about the websites and testimonials. I meant no offense to anyone here. I just meant there ARE people who do things like that. I'm not saying everyone does.

[Terry]

Jack1ynn, first of all, I believe you, you did NOT intend to insult.... Your intelligence is not a factor here, but I must say your aproach is certainly responsible for the replies you get, and attempting to project that onto others is a waste of time on your part.
You began by telling us the local practitioners were too expensive, too lacking in skill and experience, and you have no money to waste on them. I am therefore left wondering what you can do if someone here was able to ... convince you that they could indeed be of help? You have no money, no trust, no nothing that might induce any of us to take the time to help you. I pick the persons I choose to work with because success is more important to me than money, and I would never work with a distrustfull person who thinks I am after the money they don;t have. That would mean two persons wasting their time, and my time if valuable......:cool:

[tylerzambori]

wow.


"Does it work?" is sort of like going to an auto mechanic and asking if they're frauds just ripping people off.

No it would be more like going to an auto mechanic and asking if his auto mechanic methods really work. Problem with auto mechanics is most
of them, at least in my city, really are crooks, or else don't know what
they're doing. That is no implication on hypnotists, I just hate dealing with
car mechanics.

The problem is that hypnosis is, in our society, kind of an "alternative"
profession, and that is why people come into it asking if it really works.
It might be something that professional hypnotists have to learn to deal
with because of that factor. It's just going to happen.

[Don]

Tyler, your statements are simply false.
1) I don't know where you are, but in the U.S. most auto mechanics are fine people. Many have their certifications of completion of courses posted on their walls. If they do a bad job or rip people off--and some do--most states and some cities have methods of complaint and resolution.

I have no doubt that you have had trouble with car mechanics. There are always bad apples in the barrel. But to make a blanket statement that because you've had problems (specific situation) it must be that most people have had problems (the general) without providing any evidence to support the claim is illogical, inaccurate, and defamatory.

If you have documented evidence supporting your claim that most auto mechanics in your city "really are crooks," I'd like to see it.

2) Hypnosis is not an "alternative" profession. It is a profession that has been well established for decades.

3) In my years of working with hypnosis I have never had even one client ask if hypnosis works. Not one. There are some debunkers who don't care a bit about hypnosis who doubt hypnosis. There are people who, rather than get help to eliminate issues that confront them, spend years and hundreds or thousands of dollars looking for a quick fix rather than real help who go through all sorts of unproven "therapies" (usually through what they read in a newspaper or as an IROB ["I Read One Book"]) and falsely equate the thousands of years of experience with hypnosis against newly created "cures" that don't work.

4) In fact, it's the people who ask if hypnosis really works that hypnotists don't have to learn to deal with. They're not clients. They're probably not even potential clients. When I give workshops some always show up and learn that hypnosis is approved by the American Medical Association, the British Medical Association, and the American Psychological Association. They see, in my workshops, just how effective it can be. But if I never gave workshops, I'd never deal with them except at parties and casually, and I could simply smile and ignore them.

4) Contrary to your claim--again based on your ignorance of the truth and your false logic invented because you (the specific) think one way and assume that many other (the general) think that way--most people who come to professional hypnotists don't worry about whether hypnosis works, they want to know how it works and what to expect. In fact, many people want to know that it doesn't work too well. They don't want to do things they have seen hypnosis supposedly do in movies and TV.

This is not the case of my personal experience being generalized. Virtually all hypnotists I talk to say the same thing, the trainings I've attended say the same thing.

Of course, missing in your false claim is logic: If I thought a car mechanic was a fake, I wouldn't go to his shop. And if I thought hypnosis didn't work, I'd have no reason to go to a hypnotist. Nobody I know of thinks, "Hypnosis doesn't work, but I have a problem so I'll go to someone who charges for hypnosis and ask them if hypnosis works." That would just be stupid.

[tylerzambori]

Tyler, your statements are simply false.
1) I don't know where you are, but in the U.S. most auto mechanics are fine people. Many have their certifications of completion of courses posted on their walls. If they do a bad job or rip people off--and some do--most states and some cities have methods of complaint and resolution.

Whether or not they are fine people outside of the mechanic shop is irrelevant, and yes most of the mechanics in my city are either incompetent
or are crooks. I see you have not argued with my distinction that
it is about the methods though, not the honesty. I think the honesty issue came into it because of defensiveness about being questioned.

I have no doubt that you have had trouble with car mechanics. There are always bad apples in the barrel. But to make a blanket statement that because you've had problems (specific situation) it must be that most people have had problems (the general) without providing any evidence to support the claim is illogical, inaccurate, and defamatory.


wow! I said my feelings about car mechanics had nothing to do with how I see hypnotists, and here you are taking that personally anyway. Stop being so defensive.

I have enough experience with the mechanics in my city to know what the situation is, and when you take your car from place to place to get second and third and fourth opinions, you start to see how ridiculous it all is.

If you have documented evidence supporting your claim that most auto mechanics in your city "really are crooks," I'd like to see it.

how about I just say: "oh, brother." Why are you so defensive about your profession? Is it because people often question it?

2) Hypnosis is not an "alternative" profession. It is a profession that has been well established for decades.

Yes, it has been established for decades, and yes it is.


3) In my years of working with hypnosis I have never had even one client ask if hypnosis works. Not one. There are some debunkers who don't care a bit about hypnosis who doubt hypnosis. There are people who, rather than get help to eliminate issues that confront them, spend years and hundreds or thousands of dollars looking for a quick fix rather than real help who go through all sorts of unproven "therapies" (usually through what they read in a newspaper or as an IROB ["I Read One Book"]) and falsely equate the thousands of years of experience with hypnosis against newly created "cures" that don't work.

4) In fact, it's the people who ask if hypnosis really works that hypnotists don't have to learn to deal with. They're not clients. They're probably not even potential clients. When I give workshops some always show up and learn that hypnosis is approved by the American Medical Association, the British Medical Association, and the American Psychological Association. They see, in my workshops, just how effective it can be. But if I never gave workshops, I'd never deal with them except at parties and casually, and I could simply smile and ignore them.


So do you get most of your clients through your workshops? If so, I bet
at some point during your workshop you try to answer that question, even
if nobody specifically asked it.

Do you get them by referral? If so, I bet they already investigated that issue for themselves beforehand.

4) Contrary to your claim--again based on your ignorance of the truth and your false logic invented because you (the specific) think one way and assume that many other (the general) think that way--most people who come to professional hypnotists don't worry about whether hypnosis works, they want to know how it works and what to expect. In fact, many people want to know that it doesn't work too well. They don't want to do things they have seen hypnosis supposedly do in movies and TV. {/quote]

Again you turn it into a personal attack because of defensiveness.
Wouldn't it work better to remain calm and inform people? Do you get lots of attacks on hypnosis on here or something?

One way or another, if you don't even encounter that from a client, well,
one way or another they asked it of somebody or looked for it somewhere at one point. Absolutely. Is there maybe a problem with this getting trolled or something? I just find the level of defensiveness to be kind of unexpected and astounding.

[quote]This is not the case of my personal experience being generalized. Virtually all hypnotists I talk to say the same thing, the trainings I've attended say the same thing.

[quote]Of course, missing in your false claim is logic: If I thought a car mechanic was a fake, I wouldn't go to his shop. And if I thought hypnosis didn't work, I'd have no reason to go to a hypnotist. Nobody I know of thinks, "Hypnosis doesn't work, but I have a problem so I'll go to someone who charges for hypnosis and ask them if hypnosis works." That would just be stupid.


You need to calm down.

[tylerzambori]

Ps: sorry for the bad editing on my last post.

Come to think of it, it seems to me the quick reaction to a high
level of defensiveness speaks volumes, and maybe that actually turns people
away more than informing them. Unless you now regard any questioning
as trolling because you get too many trolls on here or something,
but I don't get that impression from this forum so far.

Maybe simple acceptance that most people don't know much about it,
and don't know yet if it really works because they haven't tried it,
and don't know anybody who has, would be a good thing, no?
That could help with remaining calm and simply informing people,
which would be the most positive thing.

[Poodle]

Those that come are looking for real help. Help that has not been offered to them before as they have tried everything in the world and failed! People (generalization) used to say the same thing about chiropractors. There are now numerous chiropractors in every city and again people think nothing of going to one.

I happen to adore my mechanic but then he isn't the mechanic. He's the supervisor who checks their work.

I've NEVER had the question DOES IT WORK but I've had lots of questions on HOW DOES IT WORK. Usually, it's please help me and when can I get in. I have many, many medical referrals.

A friend is having a workshop that I want to attend. It is extremely advanced. I'm not asking how does this work, why does this work. I just want to learn the same skills. Actually, I have them. They just need to be brought forward.

Pood

[Connie]

...because you get too many trolls on here or something

Or one troll with several screennames. You think we don't recognize you? The stench is familiar.

[Terry]

Maybe simple acceptance that most people don't know much about it,
and don't know yet if it really works because they haven't tried it,
and don't know anybody who has, would be a good thing, no?
That could help with remaining calm and simply informing people,
which would be the most positive thing.
Tyler, since I am long retired from practise, and now concentrate on research as a hobby, I have no monetary reason to be defensive. However, I do have a good command of the English language, and when someone asks, "Does it REALLY work"? that tells me they are asking us if we are all con artists. Now I have no reason to assume that insult was intended, after all, information was being requested, and insults don;t beget information do they? Unfortunately for the poster, her command of language is limited, in spite of an excellent educational system available to those who wish to progress in communications methods. Simple acceptance won't cut it, she needs to do the work, but lacks the education it would seem, and we do not exist to change that for her....You on the other hand, jump to conclusions too quickly it seems. That, or you are infested with more crooks in your city than exist anywere else, and see nothing wrong with looking with suspicion at everyone else.
If this is truly your attitude, you waste time here and will get short shift from those who see the positive aspects of life as important....

[Don]

Tyler, either you're establishing a very bizarre presence or are a troll. I'm going to assume that you're just being obtuse or are having some difficulty understanding analogies.

In my live I've been to dozens of auto mechanics. Most are great in their profession. A few haven't been. Now, I make sure of their references before using them. I'm not an auto mechanic as a profession, so I'm not defending them as you seem to think.

What I'm pointing out, and you have avoided, is that your personal experience is not a relevant judge of all people of a class. Change the term "auto mechanic" for "African-American" and you'll see how you're just showing unthinking prejudice.

Unless you live in a city where there are only two mechanics, I don't think you have visited more than half of them, judged their work, and really found out that more than 50% are incompetent or crooks. If you could prove it, I think your local newspapers would love to see the evidence!

I repeat, my profession is not an auto mechanic. I'm a hypnotherapist, lecturer, author, and more. I'm not being defensive, I'm just pointing out that your logic is false and your statements are based on ignorance.

I get clients the same way anyone does--through advertising, word of mouth, referral, etc. No, I never have had a person ask if hypnotism really works. That's probably because I begin by pointing out the medical associations that do recommend it because it works.

Of course, if they didn't think it works, why would they waste their time coming to a workshop on hypnosis?

If pointing out your ignorance is an attack on you, so be it. I'm ignorant in so many areas I love it when someone tells me I don't know about something and then shares with me correct information. Actually, the defensiveness you accuse me of is nothing more than your own defensiveness at being shown your ignorance. Some people--apparently such as yourself--don't like being shown where they are lacking. Some people actually prefer to remain ignorant! Imagine that. Silly, isn't it?

From your post it seems as if you think if you accuse me enough times of defensiveness I'll believe it. Sorry, Tyler. Presenting facts to your ignorance isn't being defensive. If you dislike reality and facts I suggest you go elsewhere.

I'm quite calm, thank you. However, every once in awhile I do have to stop laughing when people try to impress us with their illogic and ignorance.

Perhaps instead of being so defensive of your ignorance you might consider saying, "Gee, these people know something. Maybe I should listen to what they have to say rather than have them try to validate my fantasies and ignorance."

[Poodle]

I don't think she got what you meant. ROFL :cool:

[Poodle]

probably has a very good point. Check out info and perhaps "vote time" again. Pood

[skip]

Tyler,

Yes I can see how you might percieve it as such.

You arent the first to have that impression.

And Ill agree it sometimes isnt very flattering for us here.

If a large number of people were comming away from their interactioins here, with that opinion, I would be concerned.

I will invite you to consider another perception...

We get a lot of people who, in one form or another, ask the very same question, as is being discussed here.

Most people come here with genuine interest, and industry. We tend to respond best to those folks.

Some come wanting a quick easy fix. We can offer some advice, but really arent in a position to offer comprehensive help.

Others come trying to advance an agenda, or to impose their beliefs on us. Now, if they had any integrety, they would start their own forum, and advance their cause there honestly, instead of comming here, to attempt to hijack this one.

We tend to shut these last people down, fast.

And most of them trot out the censorship argument, and how their rights have been violated, and how we are defensive, and must be disingenuious, ad nausium.

When in fact they are the disingenuious one.

The bottom line is that if they were interesting, they would probably still be posting, and substanative, knowelegable discussion would still be going on.

And we have had a few like that. "Cassandra" comes to mind. A very smart woman, straight logical philosophiy. Was here for about two years questioning everything.

The difference between Cassandra, and for example, the more recent Sauce_Devil, was that Cassandra actually thought about what was said, even tried some of the things suggested, and came back with more pertinant questions.

Instead those so called 'debunkers', unlike Cassandra, demonstrate a severe paucity of logic, they make claims that they will not, or cannot, substantiate, and their agenda shows thru, almost instantly.

But in short they are simply boring. They clutter up the forum with the same sorry arguments delivered in the same sorry ways.

If you want to read some of that crap, it is in the archives, and welcome to it.

People come here for information. They want the responses to be from knowlegable sources, and for the most, they dont want a lot of argumentative crap, that prevails elsewhere on the internet.

So we moderators shut it down when we detect it. Not because we are trying to 'protect' our beliefs, we have already severely tested our beliefs, otherwise we wouldnt be here.

Not because we love the censroship idea ...

Because there is nothing more boring than someone who preaches so loud they cannot, will not, 'hear' what anyone else has to say.

So we invite them to preach elsewhere. If they cant hear that, we make it more plain. Most figure it out by this point. But some are too stupid, and we have to be pro-active instead of re-active.

Wouldnt it be lovely if everyone could actually listen to the effect their communication has on others, and respond by adjusting accordingly, so the other person actually does understand, what they are saying?

People with a genuine interest, and a certain level of maturity can and do, do that, and those are the folks we are interested in dialoging with, on a wide range of topics.

Some people cant do that.

Trolls dont want to do that. They have a more 'important' agenda.

The problem is that what IS important on THIS forum is what is LEAST important in the trolls world.

You dont let people in your house who treat your hospitality like that, why would you expect me to tolerate them here?

cheers,

skip

Political Correctness is the last refuge of the imbecile.

[jack1ynn]

Tyler, since I am long retired from practise, and now concentrate on research as a hobby, I have no monetary reason to be defensive. However, I do have a good command of the English language, and when someone asks, "Does it REALLY work"? that tells me they are asking us if we are all con artists. Now I have no reason to assume that insult was intended, after all, information was being requested, and insults don;t beget information do they? Unfortunately for the poster, her command of language is limited, in spite of an excellent educational system available to those who wish to progress in communications methods. Simple acceptance won't cut it, she needs to do the work, but lacks the education it would seem, and we do not exist to change that for her....You on the other hand, jump to conclusions too quickly it seems. That, or you are infested with more crooks in your city than exist anywere else, and see nothing wrong with looking with suspicion at everyone else.
If this is truly your attitude, you waste time here and will get short shift from those who see the positive aspects of life as important....


I don't see in any way how asking if it works is asking if you are all con artists. In fact, it's the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. You ARE being defensive over something ridiculous. And I feel like you are just trying to twist anything and everything I say into what you want it to be, and then getting pissed about it. You take everything negatively. And it's sad.
I didn't come on here trying to show how intelligent I am. Or for people to judge my grammar. Who cares. Seriously now. You have been nothing but insulting to ME and I still feel it is very rude and uncalled for.
I don't need to hurry and go educate myself on communication methods in order to post on this board. And actually, you would have no idea how educated I am. You don't know a single thing.
I did say that when it came to hypnosis, I knew absolutely nothing. And I also mentioned that I had heard nothing about it being used for other things besides entertainment until VERY recently.
If thats what you are referring to, then fine. But anything else is unacceptable.
You can't expect me to know everything you know in a matter of days. I'm sorry...that's not how it works. So you probably should calm down just a bit.
Also...someone else mentioned about how there are so many trolls that come here. Ok...well you complain about people questioning hypnotists and saying they're all con artists. Well um...then you're pretty much saying I'm a troll.
Hypocrisy?
Because I sure do know that I am not a troll, and know exactly what my intentions were in coming here. And had absolutely no intentions of offending anyone in ANY way.
So that really is not my fault, it's yours. You chose to take it how you wanted to. I have no control over the fact that you took it wrong. None at all. I still don't see what I said being a big deal whatsoever, nor will I ever. Sorry. I think you and a few other people are just blowing it up to be a big deal for ****s and giggles. And I really don't care. I got a few replys from people that were of use to me. Everything else I couldn't care less about. Infact, since we're all so amazingly judgemental in here. How about I'll start assuming that everyone who chooses hypnosis as a profession is arrogant, rude, narrow-minded...and pretty much is not a good person in any way.
You sure do have an amazing aproach yourself I must say. Sure does look like YOU are good at what you do. ;)
I really am so over this in every way. I am too busy for this. I will continue to look for answers and information elsewhere. But I definitely will not be coming here to learn anything whatsoever anymore. ( And no offense to any of you who aren't and haven't been jerks) Too many people are absolutely horrible at being understanding. I'm positive I can find people elsewhere who don't have sticks up their you know what and don't twist things that people say in order to feed their negative drama crazed minds. And I'm pretty sure they can inform me on this subject so much better.

[tylerzambori]

Jack1ynn,

For me I have to say that I am not a potential customer for these people,
but that shouldn't matter on a forum. I'm the one who came in here
looking for a book about positive thinking, searched the archives, and
found a recommendation for: "psycho-cybernetics." So far I'm
quite impressed with it. Using it together with "what to say when you
talk to yourself" should be pretty good for me. Even a little
experience with how this improves things is pretty good :).

If I had a problem like yours, I might consider going to professional
about it, but my god. This is a kind of thing that requires a lot of
trust to let somebody you don;t even know muck around inside
your head. And to see these people act like this does not inspire
trust. I certainly would not want people who are easily riled up
and angered, much around inside my head while I am in a suggestive
and vulnerable position, oh heck no!

[tylerzambori]

Jack1ynn,

For me I have to say that I am not a potential customer for these people,
but that shouldn't matter on a forum. I'm the one who came in here
looking for a book about positive thinking, searched the archives, and
found a recommendation for: "psycho-cybernetics." So far I'm
quite impressed with it. Using it together with "what to say when you
talk to yourself" should be pretty good for me. Even a little
experience with how this improves things is pretty good :).

If I had a problem like yours, I might consider going to professional
about it, but my god. This is a kind of thing that requires a lot of
trust to let somebody you don;t even know muck around inside
your head. And to see these people act like this does not inspire
trust. I certainly would not want people who are easily riled up
and angered, much around inside my head while I am in a suggestive
and vulnerable position, oh heck no!

Er, I meant muck, not much around inside my head.

[jack1ynn]

If I had a problem like yours, I might consider going to professional
about it, but my god. This is a kind of thing that requires a lot of
trust to let somebody you don;t even know muck around inside
your head. And to see these people act like this does not inspire
trust. I certainly would not want people who are easily riled up
and angered, much around inside my head while I am in a suggestive
and vulnerable position, oh heck no!

Hah, and that is exactly how I feel about it right now. I'm pretty much turned off by the idea of it all now.

[tylerzambori]

Hah, and that is exactly how I feel about it right now. I'm pretty much turned off by the idea of it all now.


Well, maybe it might be worth it for you to explore self-hypnosis like me :).

I'm just getting to the part in psycho-cybernetics where the author starts
to introduce some self-hypnosis techniques.

My spiritual teacher wanted me to use autogenic training to deal with
fear issues and etc., but it didn't work out, because I think I got a bad
incomplete translation from the original German. It's also so so hard
to find a good self-hypnosis book. There is a sea to wade through, and
I' m very choosy about it. It's like popular psychology books - very very
few are actually good. But that's ok, because I did find those two books
I mentioned before.

What I learned about autogenic training was ok just for learning how to
get yourself relaxed and in the right frame of mind, but leaves off there.
I understand the original German went into more, but it's ok.

I really think these two books together will do the job! The
psycho-cybernetics book does have a weird and unbelievable
story involving voodoo and aging quickly, that I could have
done without (what was he thinking), but you know, the rest
of it is actually pretty smart, and he did a lot of research which
he shares.

The one called "what to say when you talk to yourself" by shad
helmstetter, does have a slight bit of self-promotion hype around
the edges, but it's not enough to detract from the useful stuff in
there.

I'd say both books are much better than average :). If you
get "Psycho-cybernetics," make sure to get an old edition. I got
the 1960 hardcover edition, by the original author only. It was
cheap.

Best of luck to you,

Tyler

[Terry]

How wonderful that you have found yourself, or should I be saying "each other"? Have a wonderful time, and good luck with the self study I highly recommend it..

[Connie]

:) I'd call it multiple personalities, but they're all the same. :p

[tylerzambori]

:) I'd call it multiple personalities, but they're all the same. :p

You are welcome to search the forms for my previous posts. <shrug>
here's a hint: It was on the "seeking advice" forum.

The problem is, dear, what if you are wrong? What if there is even the
tiniest chance that you are wrong? How does that make you look? ...

[Don]

It's also so so hard
to find a good self-hypnosis book. There is a sea to wade through, and
I' m very choosy about it.

Tyler, while it's true that there are many books on self-hypnosis and it's good that you're choosy, I would respectfully disagree that it is hard to find a good self-hypnosis book.

There are LOTS of great self-hypnosis books. The problem is not with what is in them, but rather, how they share the information.

You see, there are only a few ways each of use get information and most people are primarily focused toward one of those ways. The difficulty is that this is so ingrained in each of us, when we try to communicate we often limit ourselves to that one way of transferring information. The result is that many, perhaps most people are left out.

So a book may be absolutely excellent, but it might completely miss the attention of 2/3 or more of the potential readers. So part of the problem is that many people may not feel any rapport with any particular book. The book itself isn't bad, it just doesn't catch on with some readers.

But there's more. Hypnosis is not like math or trigonometry. It is highly experiential. This ends up being a catch-22. You have to experience hypnosis to know what it is like, but until you experience it, you have no way of knowing if the techniques you're following are resulting in a hypnotic state.

Very often we get posts from people who think they have done some self-hypnosis when all they've really done is relax themselves. There's nothing wrong with relaxation--it's great! But it's not hypnosis.

Recently, a person came here claiming that he had read a book and tried self-hypnosis, but it didn't "stick." Therefore, he thought hypnosis was a fake. People here asked how he knew he was hypnotized. He responded that he was relaxed and when he said to himself he couldn't open his eyes he couldn't open them. When it was pointed out to him that neither indicated hypnosis, this person became very defensive insisting that he was hypnotized even though he could provide no signs that he was.

That's one of the reasons people here strongly suggest finding a professional hypnotist who will hypnotize you and show you what it's really like. It's quite likely that the hypnotist can quickly teach you self-hypnosis, too.

It's possible to learn self-hypnosis from a book, but as you've seen, it can be difficult to find a good source. And even then, without ever having been hypnotized, it's difficult to determine if you're hypnotized.

If you like, people here will be glad to recommend books on self-hypnosis. Whether or not they will work for you I really can't say. So what are they good for? Once you've experienced hypnosis and know how to do self-hypnosis, they're great in guiding you with the ways to achieve your goals with the help of hypnosis.

Learning to hypnotize is easy! Learning what to do after you are hypnotized can take lots of practice, study and training.

[tylerzambori]

well, finally, a less emotional and more balanced response. Thank you.

Tyler, while it's true that there are many books on self-hypnosis and it's good that you're choosy, I would respectfully disagree that it is hard to find a good self-hypnosis book.

There probably are, I just had a hard time myself. As my teacher and I once discussed, there are so many books on amazon with 5 star ratings that turn out to be not so great, because people give the 5 star ratings too easily.

There are LOTS of great self-hypnosis books. The problem is not with what is in them, but rather, how they share the information.

You see, there are only a few ways each of use get information and most people are primarily focused toward one of those ways. The difficulty is that this is so ingrained in each of us, when we try to communicate we often limit ourselves to that one way of transferring information. The result is that many, perhaps most people are left out.

So a book may be absolutely excellent, but it might completely miss the attention of 2/3 or more of the potential readers. So part of the problem is that many people may not feel any rapport with any particular book. The book itself isn't bad, it just doesn't catch on with some readers.

But there's more. Hypnosis is not like math or trigonometry. It is highly experiential. This ends up being a catch-22. You have to experience hypnosis to know what it is like, but until you experience it, you have no way of knowing if the techniques you're following are resulting in a hypnotic state.

Very often we get posts from people who think they have done some self-hypnosis when all they've really done is relax themselves. There's nothing wrong with relaxation--it's great! But it's not hypnosis.

Recently, a person came here claiming that he had read a book and tried self-hypnosis, but it didn't "stick." Therefore, he thought hypnosis was a fake. People here asked how he knew he was hypnotized. He responded that he was relaxed and when he said to himself he couldn't open his eyes he couldn't open them. When it was pointed out to him that neither indicated hypnosis, this person became very defensive insisting that he was hypnotized even though he could provide no signs that he was.so what are the real symptoms of self-hypnosis, just out of curiosity?

That's one of the reasons people here strongly suggest finding a professional hypnotist who will hypnotize you and show you what it's really like. It's quite likely that the hypnotist can quickly teach you self-hypnosis, too.

It's possible to learn self-hypnosis from a book, but as you've seen, it can be difficult to find a good source. And even then, without ever having been hypnotized, it's difficult to determine if you're hypnotized.

If you like, people here will be glad to recommend books on self-hypnosis. Whether or not they will work for you I really can't say. So what are they good for? Once you've experienced hypnosis and know how to do self-hypnosis, they're great in guiding you with the ways to achieve your goals with the help of hypnosis.

Learning to hypnotize is easy! Learning what to do after you are hypnotized can take lots of practice, study and training.I think I saw that already with the autogenic training, and the lack of
direction on what to do once you get there.

Hmm...I don;t know...I think I have to keep things simplified, and just see
how these two books work out for me, for now. I think they are pretty good for what to do, whether in a hypnotized state or not. This is seriously filling in the blanks the books I got on autogenic training left.

It's interesting that Maxwell Maltz puts emphasis on using the conscious mind to change the programming in the unconscious. I like that part, and
also that you don't have to go down into the subconscious to dredge
up the dirt, like a lot of psychology methods would have you do.

[skip]

tyler,

I like Maxwell too.

But Maxwell is offering you a conscious way to develop a habit, and it takes both time and discipline.

Hypnosis is much faster and doesnt require dredging up the past either.

skip

[Don]

well, finally, a less emotional and more balanced response. Thank you.

You're welcome. Look back at my other posts in this thread, too.

As my teacher and I once discussed, there are so many books on amazon with 5 star ratings that turn out to be not so great, because people give the 5 star ratings too easily.

One of the reasons I'm not a fan of the ratings on Amazon or of wikipedia in general (a good place to start, but not to rely upon).

so what are the real symptoms of self-hypnosis, just out of curiosity?

Well, I wouldn't use the term "symptoms" as it makes it sound like hypnosis is a disease! :eek: I think I'd prefer the term "signs."

The signs of hypnosis and self-hypnosis are numerous. I'm not dodging your question, I'll get to some of them in a moment. But I have to preface my comments with some information.

Hypnosis is a common, ordinary state that everyone goes into and out of, to various degrees, many times every day. Because it is ordinary, all of the signs that someone is hypnotized are, themselves, ordinary. It is the context in which they occur that makes them signs of hypnosis.

External signs include, change of skin tone, change of respiration, change of body position, change of skin color, change of pulse rate, change of the amount of light on the skin, eyes moving rapidly behind the eyelids, change or the position of the mouth and jaws, drooling, change of muscle tone, and many more.

Internally, it may be much more difficult to tell if you're hypnotized unless you've been hypnotized. Let me give a comparison. If you trip and start to fall, you immediately become aware of it, try to regain balance and perhaps put your hands out to stop the fall. You are very aware of falling from a standing or walking position.

But how do you know when you are in a balanced position and able to walk? Can you describe it or is it just a sort of "knowing?" When you first learned to ride a bicycle there were so many things you had to focus on, but one day it all came together and instead of focusing on all of those things, you just rode the bike.

From my experience, self-hypnosis is like that. I've been hypnotized by others many times, so I know what hypnosis feels like as compared to when I'm not hypnotized. Earlier I wrote that hypnosis is an ordinary state, so how can I be aware of something that is so ordinary? The answer is, in my daily tasks, the state that I'm in is not generally important to my conscious mind. I'm not focusing on my state. In hypnosis, I focus on the state.

Hypnosis is not sleep. It allows you to focus on something to the exclusion of other things. In fact, the man who came up with the name "hypnosis" wanted to change it to "monoideation," which means "one thought."

I'm glad he stuck with hypnosis! :D

So once you've been hypnotized and recognize what it feels like, self-hypnosis becomes easy and you'll know immediately whether or not you're in a state of hypnosis.

I realize that's a lot of words, but remember, hypnosis is not about books and learning, it's about experience. Describing a mental experience can be quite complex and I hope you have the idea.

...It's interesting that Maxwell Maltz puts emphasis on using the conscious mind to change the programming in the unconscious. I like that part, and also that you don't have to go down into the subconscious to dredgeup the dirt, like a lot of psychology methods would have you do.

Skip give a good answer re: conscious vs. hypnotic work. Both have their value, and if you want to give it a try, I encourage it. I've been teaching conscious methods of change for many years.

With hypnosis, it is possible to "dredge up" old memories but separate them from the emotions and pain. Thus, whatever you needed to learn from the memory can be learned without re-experiencing the bad emotions. It can give the freedom that so many people ache for.

However, for many desired changes, such deep work may not be necessary. Everybody is an individual and every issue requires unique approaches. As a human soul, living in this world, you deserve to be treated as an individual and not a robot on an assembly line.

[tylerzambori]

tyler,

I like Maxwell too.

But Maxwell is offering you a conscious way to develop a habit, and it takes both time and discipline.

Hypnosis is much faster and doesnt require dredging up the past either.

skip


I don't mind at all that it takes time and discipline.

[tylerzambori]

Well, I wouldn't use the term "symptoms" as it makes it sound like hypnosis is a disease! :eek: I think I'd prefer the term "signs."

The signs of hypnosis and self-hypnosis are numerous. I'm not dodging your question, I'll get to some of them in a moment. But I have to preface my comments with some information.

Hypnosis is a common, ordinary state that everyone goes into and out of, to various degrees, many times every day. Because it is ordinary, all of the signs that someone is hypnotized are, themselves, ordinary. It is the context in which they occur that makes them signs of hypnosis.

External signs include, change of skin tone, change of respiration, change of body position, change of skin color, change of pulse rate, change of the amount of light on the skin, eyes moving rapidly behind the eyelids, change or the position of the mouth and jaws, drooling, change of muscle tone, and many more.

I looked it up on the wiki-how:
http://www.wikihow.com/Perform-Self-Hypnosis

"It often helps to go to a professional, licensed hypnotherapist for a session first, to see what it feels like. I find that a common trait of a trance is a deeply relaxed feeling, coupled with a tingling all over my body (predominantly in my hands and feet)."


Internally, it may be much more difficult to tell if you're hypnotized unless you've been hypnotized. Let me give a comparison. If you trip and start to fall, you immediately become aware of it, try to regain balance and perhaps put your hands out to stop the fall. You are very aware of falling from a standing or walking position.

But how do you know when you are in a balanced position and able to walk? Can you describe it or is it just a sort of "knowing?" When you first learned to ride a bicycle there were so many things you had to focus on, but one day it all came together and instead of focusing on all of those things, you just rode the bike.

From my experience, self-hypnosis is like that. I've been hypnotized by others many times, so I know what hypnosis feels like as compared to when I'm not hypnotized. Earlier I wrote that hypnosis is an ordinary state, so how can I be aware of something that is so ordinary? The answer is, in my daily tasks, the state that I'm in is not generally important to my conscious mind. I'm not focusing on my state. In hypnosis, I focus on the state.

Hypnosis is not sleep. It allows you to focus on something to the exclusion of other things. In fact, the man who came up with the name "hypnosis" wanted to change it to "monoideation," which means "one thought."

I'm glad he stuck with hypnosis! :D

So once you've been hypnotized and recognize what it feels like, self-hypnosis becomes easy and you'll know immediately whether or not you're in a state of hypnosis.

I realize that's a lot of words, but remember, hypnosis is not about books and learning, it's about experience. Describing a mental experience can be quite complex and I hope you have the idea.Ok, thank you.



Skip give a good answer re: conscious vs. hypnotic work. Both have their value, and if you want to give it a try, I encourage it. I've been teaching conscious methods of change for many years.

With hypnosis, it is possible to "dredge up" old memories but separate them from the emotions and pain. Thus, whatever you needed to learn from the memory can be learned without re-experiencing the bad emotions. It can give the freedom that so many people ache for.

However, for many desired changes, such deep work may not be necessary. Everybody is an individual and every issue requires unique approaches. As a human soul, living in this world, you deserve to be treated as an individual and not a robot on an assembly line.For now I like the conscious methods. There will come a point when I'll be wanting to deal with dredging up the deep junk,
but I will do that with my teacher, by his methods. This psycho cybernetics is just an adjunct to what I' m already doing with him. It all works together.