Help!

[jodistillman]

I don't know much about hypnotherapy but wondering if it can help.

I'm having a rough year. I work in real estate (which is slow), my mother passed away from cancer a couple months back, my sister tried to kill herself a month later, my father (who was married to my mother for 43 years) announced last week he is getting remarried. My family has always been a good solid family. It seems with the passing of my mother, we have fallen apart. It is hard for me to get out of bed and function.

Last month I contacted an ex-boyfriend of mine who I hadn't spoke to in over a year. I have never been "addicted" to anything in my life except him, if that's possible. I've been so good at staying away. He's not abusive to me at all. He's just not good for me. I think contacting him was a way to try to put something good into my life that I looked forward to and it's turned out the opposite. His life has moved on and he's happy. We said our goodbyes again this morning and I know I can stay away. I just can't get of bed and move.

I am so depressed. I've never been on meds. I don't want to. I want to have moments where I feel happy again. I have kids to take care of and they are great. I'm just not being the best mom I could be.


Any suggestions?

[skip]

Hi jodi,

Id say there is a good possibility that you suffering from what is called depression. I hope you understand that I cannot make a clinical diagnosis in this manner. But from what you describe, you certainly have ample reason to be depressed.

And it is important to recognize that being depressed is something we do, it isnt something we are.

And you cant 'do' depressed all the time. You might notice that there will be times when you just 'forget' to be depressed for a moment or so. Maybe in the shower, or having a cup of tea, or anytime. It is impossible to be depressed ALL the time, it just seems like it. ;)

You might want to consider starting to deliberately remember to hold your head up with your back straight. It is very hard to stay depressed when you are in this posture.

It is easy to be depressed in you allow your head to slump down and your shoulders to droop forward.

It has been my experience, and that of my clients, that you cant 'do' depressed if you are upside down, but that isnt very practical. You might try hanging upside down off the side of the bed, for a bit in the morning. I am not sure if it is the body position or the feeling rediculous that prevents you from being able to 'do' depression, when in that position.

Maybe you just cant do, "I cant believe I am actually doing this." and depression at the same time. :)

But as foolish as that might sound, give it a try, hang off the bed, and then get up, head up, shoulders back, and NOTICE if the depression seems to dissappear for a while. It might be a short while, or a long one, but it will be gone for some length of time.

Now if you found this to be successful for you. You could use these techniques to gradually reduce the time you spend 'doing' depression, and increase the time spend doing something else.

What is the 'else' you would like to feel?

Also hypnosis and or NLP could help you quickly and easily.

cheers,

skip

ps Are you tickleish? Hard to be depressed while laughing.

[Soren K (existing)]

I am so depressed. I've never been on meds. I don't want to. I want to have moments where I feel happy again. I have kids to take care of and they are great. I'm just not being the best mom I could be.


Any suggestions?


Cardiovascular exercise will go a long way to helping you out. For example, run 1-2 miles a day - which will take you about 7-10minutes, you will notice a difference immediately. It is very easy to do, takes up a very small portion of your day, and won't cost you any money. What is there to lose?

[Don]

Warning!

Do not start ANY exercise program without first checking with your doctor.

The suggestion to do otherwise is strictly that of the poster and does not reflect the opinion or suggestion of the owners of this forum.

Physical exercise can increase the production of the endorphin hormone resulting in feelings of contentment, happiness, etc. However you should not begin an exercise program without the approval of your physician.

[jdavis]

Also, I'm sorry for everything that happened.

I was just wondering if you had gave yourself time to grieve. Or maybe I mean the permission to be grieving. I just wonder that because there are places in your post where I felt like you were so stunned from all that had happened since your mother passed away that you were wanting things to be back the same. And then, when they weren't, you were putting your head back under the cover thinking that maybe, when you wake up next time, they would be back to "normal". Then it just becomes a loop.

So I was thinking, that maybe if you said,

"boy, this all sure sucks;
Mom? Can you believe all this is happening?!?
I sure miss you.
And the way things used to be."

And then let yourself think about the way things used to be for a minute. And then,

"Mom, what can I do with the NEW way things are?"

And then if you listen for the answer door that she put there as you were growing up, well, then you have given yourself permission and space to grieve, miss her AND accept the new paradime all at once. Because I think they are all important to allow.

btw, i'm just a person, who happened to be on this forum when you posted and this is just my thoughts about what you wrote.

[Poodle]

Skip is very, very correct. It's absolutely impossible to be depressed when you are laughing, I mean a deep belly laugh that about makes you fall on the floor. I just read an article on MSN about clinical depression, psychiatrists and anti-depression medication. It seems to be more of a placebo effect than anything else and a placebo worked well in 50% of the cases. Convince yourself they are happy pills!

[Henrik]

In my opinion...


Most anyone should do some form of exercise. Kids used to do it all the time prior to the era of computer games and fast food...
It is very hard to not do any form of exercise... how do you do that? Typing on the computer is a form of exercise. Completing Tour the France is another form of exercising. There are many levels in between...
Too little exercise will cause atrophy of muscle and bone... Mind and matter(body). Matter(body) and mind.
Personal trainers and doctors that I have talked with say that most people exercise way too little or to lightly. I haven't talked with every doctor or personal trainer there is.
Believing that exercise alone will help eliminate what might be a depression... well I don't believe that (and I don't think that is what Soren K intended either). Go to any gym and you will encounter people using training and exercising as a suppressant for emotional issues.
If you suspect some form of physical issue that needs special attention, consult with your doctor. Ask him/her to help you set up a form of exercise program if you not already have one.There are many great hypnotherapists and NLPers on this forum Jodi. Skip, Don, Poodle who have already replied to your question, and several others. I don't think Soren K is a hypnotherapist (but a very smart man he is). I'm not a hypnotherapist. If you follow their advice I'm sure you will achieve your goal of being happy.

Regards,
Henrik

[Don]

Henrik, there is a BIG difference between saying everyone should do some form of exercise and telling a person to do a specific form of exercise. The latter can be seen as a prescription, and to give it is practicing medicine without a license.

Further, since this is a question of weight, we don't know what issues that weight might have caused. Excess weight can cause problems with heart, lungs, kidneys, liver, etc. Telling someone to run 1-2 miles within 10 minutes could result in asthmatic issues, heart attack, or other problems such as harming the joints of the knees, hips, and ankles. Plus, if a person is not used to running and cannot do Soren's prescription, they have "failed." Failure in one area in life often bleeds over to other area: failure breeds more failure.

Coming from a practical, hypnotherapeutic, and legal viewpoint, the suggestion for exercise should always have the proviso of obtaining an okay from a physician first. The longer it has been since doing any form of active aerobic or anaerobic exercise, the greater the need for such an okay.

Although I am not a physician (nor do I play one on TV :) ) I still agree with the primary rule of the Hippocratic Oath: first, do no harm. The prescription given by Soren--without so much as even seeing his patient--while well meaning was poorly considered, unwise, and possibly dangerous to the life and well being of the original poster.

One of the things mentioned years ago in the following post:
http://www.hypnosisforum.com/showthread.php?t=1074
is that on this forum we cannot give therapy. It's impractical and unethical. People do try...a person makes a post, someone follows up with a suggestion, but then the original poster gives more information that invalidates the suggestion. That is why professionals do NOT diagnose without seeing a client. This is exactly what Soren did, and it is wrong.

As you pointed out. Soren is smart but not a hypnotherapist. Part of any good hypnotherapy training, IMO, would include dealing with legal issues.

This is NOT just a question of only going to a physician if you "suspect" you may have a physical problem. By the time you have such a suspicion, a great deal of damage may have already occurred. Most people who have heart attacks, brain attacks, etc. never have any pre-existing symptoms, or at least none of which they are aware.

Apart from all of the ethical considerations, let me repeat and make this clear: in the U.S., unless you are a licensed medical professional, it is ILLEGAL to recommend specific prescriptions such as exercise. Considering that this is a hypnosis forum, to make such a prescription here is not merely practicing medicine without a license, but it is doing so "under the guise of authority," which adds another level to possible criminal prosecution and civil liability. As a moderator, it is my responsibility to make sure that comments here do not break the law. Sometimes it is a close call, sometimes it is not. I considered deleting Soren's post due to the dangers it suggested, but instead decided to add the disclaimer.

Exercise IS a good thing. Prescribing specific forms of exercise without being a physician and without an in-person interview and tests of a person is unethical, impractical, potentially dangerous, and possibly illegal.

[Terry]

Jodi, there are many ways to overcome depression, if in fact that is what you are suffering from. However, as has already been said, we cannot diagnose with any sense of certainty if this is in fact the case.
Consider what you offer, death of a loved one! This normally leads to a form of depression which lasts for a time only, and some consider this to be a nescessary period to purge the soul as it were....Loss of business due to local depression in sales? Well this is normal since business is cyclical, but when it occurs at the same time as one is grieving the loss of a loved one, can lead to having nothing to do but brood....
One thing is obvious from your various comments, and that is that you are reaching out to others for help to recover. Might I suggest that you have within yourself all that you need to change your outlook? Doing so will cost nothing, and that is a plus since business is slow so income is reduced. I suggest that you consider helping others by volunteering your time to help say at a local food bank, or driving clients to treatment for Cancer, or one of the many volunteer needs in your community.
Of course you do need to know that whatever your choice, some effort on your part will be required, so I would strongly suggest that you do what you can for yourself first. The boy friend won't help because he lacks the skills, so it is up to you to act in your own interests and that of your children. Another alternative would of course be to get a different job, one that requires much concentration from you.
However, your question was, "can hypnosis help" so to answer that, yes it can if properly used by a skilled person. Now please don;t ask us how to find such a person, because we have no idea who will best fit your needs. That is one of the efforts you must make for yourself.

[Henrik]

Hi, Don.

I have reread Jodi's post and I cannot find anything about she having a weight issue...

Any person has a choice between exercising and not exercising. If the person is unsure about how and how much by all means consult with a doctor.

Many people will start an exercising program without consulting a doctor. I would argue that in more than 50% of the cases that is a better choice than not starting an exercising program without consulting a doctor.

My post was not meant as advice to Jodi if she in particular should exercise or not, it was some thoughts on physical exercising general.

Regards,
Henrik

[Connie]

Walking is a wonderful way to start feeling better---not a prescription for anyone else, just a comment on my life. Slow is fine. Just getting out, moving your body, looking at "nature," hopefully you have some nice parklike setting and not just concrete and exhaust fumes.

[Don]

Connie, you're absolutely right! Walking is a wonderful exercise and great way to feel better and even lose weight...IF a person is healthy enough to do it.

I still remember my first hypnosis training. We're not even allowed to tell a person to eat more vegetables and less fats and sugars. However, we can ask if they think that would be a good idea and if it's okay to suggest that. If so, it's not our "prescription," rather, it's simply helping them achieve a goal that they want.

[Don]

Henrik, you are correct. I erred in saying this was a question of weight. I was conflating this in my mind with another thread. I apologize for making the statement and thank you for correcting me.

Be that as it may, since we have not seen the person, and have not done an in-depth health interview, we have no idea what Jodi's weight or health is. Nor is making a prescription from the guise of authority legal. Therefore, although I erred in mentioning weight, I stand by my other statements and conclusions.

[Henrik]

Henrik, you are correct. I erred in saying this was a question of weight. I was conflating this in my mind with another thread. I apologize for making the statement and thank you for correcting me.


That will be $200 please. My account number is 1234567890-0987654321, alternatively using PayPal is recommended ;).


Be that as it may, since we have not seen the person, and have not done an in-depth health interview, we have no idea what Jodi's weight or health is. Nor is making a prescription from the guise of authority legal.


Wouldn't argue a word.

In your first reply to Jodi you said:

"Do not start ANY exercise program without first checking with your doctor."

Well, if being picky I do not agree entirely. The statement, as a standalone at least, makes imo assumptions about Jodi's and/or other peoples level and knowledge about exercising and physical health.

Suggesting that anyone should start exercising without seeing them in person is not the wisest thing to do imo for the reasons you mentioned. If we play the game of probability another conclusion might be reached... but we don't play that game do we...

Anyway, now I'm rambling and I will stop.

Regards,
Henrik

[MrDigital]

In a depressed 'state' you are lacking the resources to succesfully deal with your current situation, hence your request for assistance.

Consider the offerings by first framing them in a particular context for a specific outcome. e.g I am feeling pretty bad about life at present and as a result may not have the resources to think clearly about this issue/problem/challenge. I will do X as offered and then utilise whatever resources are available to create new choices. By framing you have the power to take away any 'but I should feel like this, it's only right' type thoughts.

Then find somewhere outdoors like your local Mall or somewhere there are plenty of people about and set yourself the task of walking to a particular place, 5 minutes walking minimum.


Adjust your awareness and see/hear/ and feel as much as you can...
Move your awareness on to your physiology and take a mental snapshot of yourself, then as you walk start adjusting your physiology. Talk to yourself and try things on i.e "relax shoulders, leave a gap between jaw, deep breath, and longer stride". What 'feels' right wear it and disregard the rest. As you continue get into things a little bit more maybe a wiggle of your bum and a pout of your lips - click your fingers to a beat or create some kind of rythym that you can move to.. you get my drift ....

Any thoughts that appear accept them YES even negative ones and remember the frame (the reason you are doing this). And when you find you have achieved what I call a 'high performance state' basically you have your resources and your clarity - then you can choose to evaluate your situation knowing full well you have the ability to step out if required after you have stepped back in to 'evaluate'..

This is only for your consideration and I am by no means an expert, however I can empathise to an extent...

Regards

MrD


I like to set myself a by the time I reach e.g Starbucks type goal

[Soren K (existing)]

Henrik, there is a BIG difference between saying everyone should do some form of exercise and telling a person to do a specific form of exercise. The latter can be seen as a prescription, and to give it is practicing medicine without a license.

Coming from a practical, hypnotherapeutic, and legal viewpoint, the suggestion for exercise should always have the proviso of obtaining an okay from a physician first. The longer it has been since doing any form of active aerobic or anaerobic exercise, the greater the need for such an okay.

Although I am not a physician (nor do I play one on TV :) ) I still agree with the primary rule of the Hippocratic Oath: first, do no harm. The prescription given by Soren--without so much as even seeing his patient--while well meaning was poorly considered, unwise, and possibly dangerous to the life and well being of the original poster.

Henrik,

Thanks for your comments. I thought about replying to Don's disclaimer because it seemed (at first glance) overblown. However, really he is right to add it so I thought it should stand without argument, I respect the suggestion.

Two minor items: the poster asked 'any suggestions?', so I obliged. Second, running 1-2 miles a day is qualified 'for example'... People's lives can appear ruined by tragedy, I saw a mountaineer who lost both his legs from the knee down to frostbite, devestated by the thought he would never climb again and enjoy the satisfaction it provided, learn to walk with two little manmade legs to eventually and successfully climb mount everest. People whose legs have been crushed have spun their wheels to olympic gold medals. I wonder what it takes to have a will like that, I really admire it.

It's interesting to me how motivated people can feel by their circumstances - personally it is much easier to destroy depressing or depreciating thoughts than to have them, adopt a decent posture and put thought and body into action. At the same time, you are all my mentors - so I'll remain thankful

Regards,
Soren

[Don]

Hi, Soren.

You're right that your putting "for example" qualifies your comment--for you. When someone knows nothing about who you are and comes to a site such as this, he or she may assume that your "suggestion" is a "prescription" because you came on as an authority on a site dedicated to the subject. This is called "guise of authority," and even though your "for example" may be a qualifier for you, it may not be for people dropping in.

As I wrote, we have no way of knowing this person's health. They may not be able to safely start with running 2 miles in under 10 minutes as you suggested. Not only could that be a health risk, but even if it has no negative physical effects, their failure to succeed could induce further depression and anxiety, as well as failure in other areas of life, the exact opposite of what you have suggested.

If it is "easier to destroy depressing or depreciating thoughts than to have them," why do so many people suffer from depression? It may be true for you, but I would contend that for many, if not most people suffering from depression, this is not their reality. Going from a specific example to a generalization may not be a valid practice.

[Soren K (existing)]

If it is "easier to destroy depressing or depreciating thoughts than to have them," why do so many people suffer from depression? It may be true for you, but I would contend that for many, if not most people suffering from depression, this is not their reality. Going from a specific example to a generalization may not be a valid practice.Don,

I've no bones about the disclaimer, you did the right thing - best to cover all bases.

Over here they have 'something' called S.A.D. (Seasonal Adjustment Disorder) said to be while 'so many' people feel 'down' this time of year (or over the coming months). Maybe such descriptions are useful. A person can get some measure of objectivity if they can establish what's confronting them. Thereafter, they can take some action... Or, perhaps, with these things some kind of futility kicks in. I've a friend who is schizophrenic who understands that his condition is the result of overactive receptors in his brain (physiologically accurate description). But he's almost resigned to it, he'll always be this way, the drugs are required to settle things down, take away the drugs and the condition is still there. I don't know what the solution is, maybe he's right. I wouldn't like to resign myself to that, nor even to validate it. Somehow I just don't want to believe that that's the only option, and then again, I've seen him go six months without the drugs and become someone extremely difficult to be around. With the S.A.D. maybe the futility is okay, 'I'll feel better (normal) again in a little while, after I've adjusted to the season'. With depression, what are the choices? Perhaps many people think they are depressed. Perhaps there is some kind of comfort in that. Perhaps my friend thinks he's schizophrenic (perhaps there is some kind of comfort in that). Perhaps there is a high case of S.A.D. in the north of Scotland. Perhaps I can say, for me, bullsh*t. Who says this is who and how I am? I can be who I want, right? What I want. I spend my formative years wanting what I want, why now should I have stopped. Thoughts of all varieties come easy: depressing, depreciating, fun loving, confident. I don't really want to validate that it's easier for people to be depressed. It really isn't - this is mostly why people eventually choose to do something about it. Whatever that is, however they choose to choose to do something about it, well, yep, I encourage that. I hope Jodi finds her way soon. Her life is too valuable, for her, for others.

Best,
Soren.

[Don]

Without making a diagnosis or prescription, I do note that over here in the U.S., a lot of people are treating S.A.D. with full-range lighting. If someone is diagnosed with S.A.D. they might ask their doctor about that.

I used to live in Minnesota where we had "nine months of winter and three months of bad skiing." Even though there was plenty of sun during those long cold winters, I began to notice that I was feeling depressed at times (not to a diagnosable level--I was just feeling down). This started a long cycle of self-reflection and analysis.

I came to the conclusion that for me, the cause of S.A.D. was that everything we literally or metaphorically dead. There were no animals, birds, or small plants that were alive and growing. Most trees had dropped their leaves and appeared dead.

If we assume that all living things have a life energy--and I do--then it wasn't the lack of activity and life that was affecting me. Rather, it was the lack of interplay and involvement between my life force and the inwardly-focused life force of any remaining living things.

When I had this realization, I immediately started meditative practices that would up my life force energy. As a result, the S.A.D. vanished.

Now, this was only a person experience. I don't know if it was my meditation, my focus, or simply that my actions functioned as a placebo.

Interesting thing, life.

I agree with you about Jodi.