What exactly is a "map" ????

[John Warner]

what exactly is a map, as referred to in nlp, and how exactly is this experienced on the personal level?

[pmdigi]

I think your "map" is how you represent the world to yourself in your mind.

[Poodle]

it means that no two of us share the same reality. With proper training one may gain access to another's "map"

[skip]

John,

The classic example is the difference between a menu and the actual meal.

The menu referrs to the meal, and tells you a lot about it, but it obviouslly isnt as tasty as the meal, and certainly isnt as nourishing.

The problem in 'real' life is when people begin to mistake the menu for the meal.

For example, when a client says, "Im depressed.", it is common for the therapast to look to their own meaning of the word depressed, and understand the client to be having exacty the same feelings that the thrapast has when they do 'depressed'.

But it wont be exact, it might not even be close!

The idea is that`reality is out there somewhere and we all experience it. But none of us experience reality exactly as it is. And none of us experience reality the same way. Similar yes, but not exact.

To believe you know reality, or to know what others are experiencing, is to invite disaster, in the theraputic context, because you have confused the menu for the meal.

skip

[Poodle]

Are you saying my textbook and the books I studied from are totally incorrect re: pacing "it is possible to graciously enter their unique personal reality and begin to understand the world as they experience it"? Obviously, this goes to say that our concepts of "reality" are usually out of conscious awareness. Pood -- back to state of confusion :confused:

[Simon]

Literally "the map" simply means the end product of how do we process raw informations.

Raw informations (the territory)-> senses -> judgement (restrictions of your mind, eg. deletion and generalization) -> your sense of reality (the map)

Simplified.

So you can notice that the map in merely a poor representation of reality.

[Simon]

informations=information :D

I'm embarrassed :o

[Poodle]

English as a second language and you say embarrassed? Come on -- that doesn't fit into anyone's reality in my reality. Pood :D

[skip]

Yes they are incorrect.

You cant know exactly what their experience is.

BUT

Good pacing will get you soooo connected with someone else that it will certainly SEEM as if you do.

For example, if you are practicing pacing someone. and you calibrate to their experience of 'love'.

While they are doing 'love, you are sensing whatever it is that you are sensing.

It isnt what they are sensing, but you can know that the next time they lead you back to the sensations you are having , that THEY are sensing 'love'.

So you can KNOW WHEN they are doing 'love', because you 'sense' it; but you still dont know WHAT the experience is for them. (It could involve a German Sheppard for all you know, and you dont even own leiderhalter.) ;)

That is why it is so importasnt to use their words, because if you translate it into what is meaningful to you, it wont be the same for them. But you will still be operating under the delusion that you are both speaking of the same thing.

cheers,

skip

[Poodle]

I enjoy you so much - a German Shepherd -- how 'bout a Yellow Lab? ;)

[Merlin]

I enjoy you so much - a German Shepherd -- how 'bout a Yellow Lab? ;)

or a poodle?

[Poodle]

The Pood has crossed over The Rainbow Bridge and is waiting for me. I'm now Pom'd; however, if I change my name to "me", I lose all my previous posts????

Maybe a signature line could be: Pomeranians Rule - Other Dogs Drool -- LOL!! :)

[Merlin]

The Pood has crossed over The Rainbow Bridge and is waiting for me. I'm now Pom'd; however, if I change my name to "me", I lose all my previous posts????

Maybe a signature line could be: Pomeranians Rule - Other Dogs Drool -- LOL!! :)

LOL
I'm sure something could be done.
But then I wouldn't know who i'm talking to.
<In memory of the poodle>

[skip]

A self respecting yellow lab or poodle wouldnt be caught dead doing some of the things a German`sheppard will do.

We do have our standards!

cooper

[John Warner]

thanks guys, this answers my question in spades.

okay.. one last post..

[Poodle]

EXACTLY! Skip and I went over some options and nothing seemed to work really well. Guess I'll forever remain the "talking Poodle" around here. LOL!

[pmdigi]

Dear Anne, - This is just a crazy idea I know, but if you change your signature to "Anne", then all your previous posts will automatically be signed by "Anne".:)

[Merlin]

That's what can happen if you choose poodle for a name.
You could choose dawg, but what if you get a cat?
or Anne, so long as you don't change that.

[figure]

I was thinking more figuratively like everyone is here at a certain time we'll say point B. But, they came from a starting point, A. But they all went different paths to get to their representation of reality.

[skip]

They not only go different paths, but they arrive at different points.