robert shields home course

[meathead]

has anyone tried this home course,and what kind of results have u achieved

[firegold]

I took this course a while ago. It's not bad, though it is a little on the basic side and doesn't even get into Ericksonian hypnosis at all (iirc, it doesn't mention it, even; it does mention indirect suggestion vs. direct suggestion, but doesn't go into great detail on that). Overall, you'll get a decent level of knowledge of "traditional" hypnosis from it, mostly a directive style.

The main downside is you get no practice. You have to find that yourself.

You also don't get feedback--"Am I doing this right? Am I missing something?" You also don't get to *see* anything demonstrated; it's all text.

That said, imo, it doesn't mean it's a bad course. You'll just have to work harder to really get a good grounding in hypnosis. You'll need to find practice partners (yes, partners; you want more than one so you get used to dealing with different people) and you'll want to also pursue other educational avenues. Get as many books as you can and read them, as well. There are plenty of reading lists available out there, and on these forums.

When I took the course, I did so because I needed a certification and a way to get into a hypnosis organization. I'd already had a lot of knowledge of other approaches from previous trainings, studying and experience. If I'd been just starting out, however, I'd have been terribly disappointed in the course.

It's almost always better to get live training if you can afford it.

If you can't afford it and can't wait, something like Robert Shield's course can be valuable and useful. If you take the extra effort to *make* it useful. Just be aware it takes a little more work than being in a live class does.

Joshua

PS. Almost forgot to answer the "what results" question. I got the results I wanted; a nice certificate to hang on the wall and I got to see someone else's approach to things. Always a useful thing. My desired results are not necessarily your desired results, though.

What do *you* want out of it?

[meathead]

ultimately I would like to set up an hypnotherapy practice ,but I would like a good working knowledge of the subject

[Poodle]

If you want to eventually set up a practice, you are going to have to have live, in person training. You need to decide if you want to be a Certified Clinical Hypnotherapist (CCHT) or a Certified Hypnotist/Hypnotherapist CH or CHt) as the training is vastly different.

If you look through past posts, you will note there are DVD courses available that have graded tests. I really would not want without at least having a 3 day in person training. It seems to me that the majority of Instructors do omit Ericksonian which is a dirty shame in my opinion. There are some of us nice people around that like to give a well rounded course which includes the owner of this Forum. We have a member, Keith Livingston, in the member section that does make fine hypnosis material. I never checked out any of the beginner material so I really cannot say what it is like.

You certainly do not want to read text. I know it seems strange that one can learn a lot about hypnosis in three days but you need to understand that we are working with your unconscious mind, not your conscious mind. The days are also very long but you won't care as you will be having fun. Check Dr. Matt's James' schedule and see if any of his people are going to be around or let us know where you are and maybe we will be able to find something for you.

[Connie]

I can vouch for Keith's home study materials, books and videos--they are FIRST RATE!

[Jack]

ultimately I would like to set up an hypnotherapy practice ,but I would like a good working knowledge of the subject

Poodle has said it, but it is worthwhile saying again: get some live training.
No matter how good a home study course is you will learn more from two or three days with actual people than you will in ten years of home study.

So many times have I been introduced to 'hypnotherapists' and found that their live training was actually on paying clients and they had 'qualified' through some dubious online course costing a few pounds.

These people are not hypnotherapists and their certificates are pretty but worthless, as far as I am concerned. I, and others, occasionally have to deal with the aftermath created by these amateurs.

By all means learn about hypnotherapy, but do not think that reading about it qualifies you to do it. Get proper training and avoid people like me who will come down on you like a ton of bricks.:eek: :)


Jack

[Binnkin]

What is the difference between a certified clinical hypnotherapist, and a certified hypnotist/hypnotherapist?

[Jack]

What is the difference between a certified clinical hypnotherapist, and a certified hypnotist/hypnotherapist?

One word on a certificate.

Jack

[Don]

"Clinical" always refers to working with people. If a hypnotist doesn't work with clients--perhaps he or she experiments with subjects for research--they're not a clinical hypnotherapist. "Certified" means that you have met some groups goals for excellence.

[Poodle]

I don't know if people have bothered to read "The Journal of Hypnotism" from June 2007 or not. It states and is true that Clinical means MUCH MORE STUDY IN DIFFERING AREAS OF ISSUES. If one wishes to be a Certified Clinical Hpnotherapist, there are just a few schools in the USA that teach it. It's usually about three months straight training in person and seems to have been started by Gil Boyne. When one finishes study, there is a huge exam one takes and if passed one is given a licensed number. NGH has offered a course in Clinical Hypnosis that is 14 months that one can do at home as members have already had a minimum of 100 hours of training. It does NOT give the title of Certified Clinical Hypnotherapist tho. You are still just a Certified Hypnotist.

Dr. Matt has a totally different view and one can go for three days or all the way to a Doctorate in Hypnosis. His father has his doctorate in Ericksonian Hypnosis. I don't know in which area Dr. Matt specialized.

I hope this puts the matter to rest once and for all for everyone's edification. If it is still misunderstood, I will be glad to post the criteria to be a Certified Clinical Hypnotherapist on the Forum.

The words Certified Clinical in the USA do mean extended learning and not with NLP or any other subject matter.

Pood

[Don]

I am going by the dictionary definition which describes "clinical" as "of or relating to the observation and treatment of actual patients rather than theoretical or laboratory studies." Thus, the difference between, say, a psychologist and a clinical psychologist is that the latter works with patients while the former does not.

If the NGH offers a different definition, more power to them! However, except for the NGH, I stand by what I wrote. So we'll just have to agree to disagree.

Personally, I would prefer a series of titles that are accepted by several certification groups and that clearly represent the level of study and experience a hypnotherapist possesses. IMO this should include both certain amounts of study and certain amounts of working with clients (what is commonly called, uh, "clinical practice").

It could go something like this:

Certified Hypnotist (X amount of hours study)
Hypnotist (X amount of hours study + Y amount of hours of clinical practice)
Certified Master Hypnotist (XX amount of hours study + Y hours practice)
Master Hypnotist (XX hours study + YY hours practice)
Certified Grandmaster Hypnotist (XXX hours study + YY hours practice)
Grandmaster Hypnotist (XXX hours study + YYY hours practice)

Plus specialties, etc. And this is only and idea, I'm sure people could come up with better names and titles.

[Connie]

I like the sound of "Master Hypnotist," Don. :) Mastery at anything is a fantastic thing! I like "Grandmaster" better as two words: Grand Master. :) Doesn't the word "Don" mean top the pile as well? How about a "Don Hypnotist?" :D

[Merlin]

I am going by the dictionary definition which describes "clinical" as "of or relating to the observation and treatment of actual patients rather than theoretical or laboratory studies." Thus, the difference between, say, a psychologist and a clinical psychologist is that the latter works with patients while the former does not.

If the NGH offers a different definition, more power to them! However, except for the NGH, I stand by what I wrote. So we'll just have to agree to disagree.

Personally, I would prefer a series of titles that are accepted by several certification groups and that clearly represent the level of study and experience a hypnotherapist possesses. IMO this should include both certain amounts of study and certain amounts of working with clients (what is commonly called, uh, "clinical practice").

It could go something like this:

Certified Hypnotist (X amount of hours study)
Hypnotist (X amount of hours study + Y amount of hours of clinical practice)
Certified Master Hypnotist (XX amount of hours study + Y hours practice)
Master Hypnotist (XX hours study + YY hours practice)
Certified Grandmaster Hypnotist (XXX hours study + YY hours practice)
Grandmaster Hypnotist (XXX hours study + YYY hours practice)

Don't forget 'Grand Poobah'

[Merlin]

I like the sound of "Master Hypnotist," Don. :) Mastery at anything is a fantastic thing! I like "Grandmaster" better as two words: Grand Master. :) Doesn't the word "Don" mean top the pile as well? How about a "Don Hypnotist?" :D

Don a hypnotist.
If the shoe fits... (or Don) wear him.

[Don]

LOL!
Does a Don Hypnotist give suggestions that clients can't refuse?

[Merlin]

Don:
# noun: Celtic goddess; mother of Gwydion and Arianrhod; corresponds to Irish Danu

# noun: the head of an organized crime family

[Poodle]

In Spanish, a sign of respect don Don. I never even called my in-laws by their first names as it was always dona Raquel or don Bernardo. It was respect that they were older and more knowledgeable than I was even though I was referred to as "mi hija".

[Jack]

In the UK someone qualified as an hypnotherapist can use the term 'clinical' if they wish to. In practical terms it has no significance other than that the client ascribes to it. In other words it makes the qualification sound more medical, and therefore more marketable.

I know quite a few 'clinical' hypnotherapists whom I would not wish on my worst enemy.

Jack

[Poodle]

I know one that is indeed a graduated Certified Clinical Hypnotherapist. This person knew nothing of inductions and just enough NLP to be dangerous as in really making someone angry. I called the school and asked exactly what type of graduates they were putting out into the world. The comment was: "You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it drink". I hope the others are a heck of a lot better -- by 99.9%.

[pmdigi]

If what you both seem to be saying is true, then how in the hell do you you know if one is any good?

[Poodle]

lies the problem. That person got all kinds of personal problems taken care of at the 3 month training but apparently did not pick up on the people skills. Met another who just had a bit from APU and while short of inductions, had a magnificent imagination and would do very well going into the script writing business.

It's been mentioned before that we all need to come to an agreement of what is what and that an apprenticeship should be mandatory but no one can even agree on what things are or are not let alone try to make anything mandatory.

From what I have seen personally, I would definitely say that we have some of the best here.

[Jack]

If what you both seem to be saying is true, then how in the hell do you you know if one is any good?

You don't. Until hypnotherapy has a fully specified career path leading to a fairly universal qualification and membership of an independent professional organisation which demands the qualification in order to legally practice then you have no idea even if they have received any training at all.

I can set up a school online tomorrow, offer a hundred pages of 'training' followed by a nice looking certificate saying 'certified clinical hypnotherapist' and you can be treating clients by the end of the week.

You take the same risk you would take if you were seeking to engage a bricklayer to do your new extension. In one case your house might fall down. In the other your mind might fall down.

The only way to mitigate the risk of unqualified hypnotherapists is to check if they have any qualifications at all, then check what they are and how they were gained, then check which professional organisation they belong to and if it can be joined by Tom, Dick and Harry or if they need to pass a stringent entry requirement to become a member.

Doing this is not a guarantee, but the neither is choosing a new medical doctor. Life is a risk, but there are calculated risks and foolish risks. Trusting your emotional welfare to an unchecked hypnotherapist falls into the latter category.

Jack

[Poodle]

there was a guy that got his cat certified as a hypnotist. Forged all kinds of papers -- sort of like the person that recently got their dog registered to vote. Officials are having a hard time trying to figure out how to "unregister" the dog. What's that old song "Girls just wanna have fuuunnnn"? Pood

[Don]

I remember him very well. He claimed it proved that certification was meaningless. I said it proved that if people lied enough they could deceive honest people. He became very upset with that and said he wasn't lying. I asked him what he called it.

He never posted again.

The truth is, if someone lies to certification boards and pays money for certification, they can get certified. It happens in all sorts of professions.

I would add that this person's cat is not a practicing hypnotist so whether or not it was certified is irrelevant. I would say there is absolutely no reason for a person who wants to be a hypnotherapist to lie to get certified with the qualifications are so minimal. I would guess that 99%+ of practicing hypnotists who are certified have passed the qualifications for certification and not lied about it.

[Jack]

If someone lies to a certification board and they accept the lie without checking, what does that say about either the board ot the organisation which they represent?

To practice medicine in the UK you need around 7 years of training both at university and in hospital. To practice hypnotherapy you need nothing. I am not suggesting that there is an equivalence between medical practice and hypnotherapy because in terms of required knowledge there is not, but until we are all prepared to face some hard truths about our own 'profession' we will not progress and hypnotherapy will remain linked with stage shows and parlour tricks and not seen as the powerful and beneficial tool we all know it to be.

And if we don't do it, then it will be hijacked by the medical profession and hypnotherapy will become just another two day training course towards a medical degree and the term 'hypnotherapist' consigned to history.

Of course, that scenario may not necessarily be a bad one. Unless you happen to be a client.:eek:

Jack

[Don]

Jack wrote, "If someone lies to a certification board and they accept the lie without checking, what does that say about either the board ot the organisation which they represent?"

To me, it says they are an honest organization and expect people who are certified by them also to be honest. You are correct about the difference between medical and hypnotherapeutic training. And yet, every year we hear about people who are horrible as doctors or who give illegal amounts of drugs to their famous patients. Every year, (according to one source, http://www.hypnosisforum.com/showthread.php?p=48376#poststop ) There are approximately 98,000 preventable medical errors every year in the U.S. and medical negligence is the 8th leading cause of death. So all that training and licensing and investigation by various groups doesn't seem to be having a great deal of success.

And how many deaths are due to hypnotherapy each year? Zero. None. Nada.

My suggestion to get better quality certification: Right now, the costs and requirements for certification by the two major certification boards in the U.S. are very minimal and are "for profit." As a result, they cannot afford to do any sort of investigation into prospective members.

In a previous post I suggested titles related to levels of training, experience, and proficiency. Now I suggest the creation of a non-profit board to administer such certifications, based on the concept that as you increase in training and experience, the number of your clients and earnings should increase.

I would suggest that this board charge at least $500 per year for basic certification and increase for each level of certification. Part of this money would be used to hire people to investigate claims of training and experience levels by prospective members. I would predict that by having such a price for being certified would eliminate any of the jokers or non-professionals from joining. With the income they could also investigate claims against individual hypnotists and support laws that help hypnosis as a non-licensed alternative medical practice and stand in opposition to laws that harm hypnotherapy and stage hypnosis.

[Connie]

...support laws that help hypnosis as a non-licensed alternative medical practice and stand in opposition to laws that harm hypnotherapy and stage hypnosis.

My local chapter of the NGH is urging members to join a union for just those purposes.

[Jack]

Jack wrote, "If someone lies to a certification board and they accept the lie without checking, what does that say about either the board ot the organisation which they represent?"

To me, it says they are an honest organization and expect people who are certified by them also to be honest.
.

Or it could say 'we don't care how you became certified, give us your joining fee'.

Don said:
In a previous post I suggested titles related to levels of training, experience, and proficiency. Now I suggest the creation of a non-profit board to administer such certifications, based on the concept that as you increase in training and experience, the number of your clients and earnings should increase.

I would suggest that this board charge at least $500 per year for basic certification and increase for each level of certification. Part of this money would be used to hire people to investigate claims of training and experience levels by prospective members. I would predict that by having such a price for being certified would eliminate any of the jokers or non-professionals from joining. With the income they could also investigate claims against individual hypnotists and support laws that help hypnosis as a non-licensed alternative medical practice and stand in opposition to laws that harm hypnotherapy and stage hypnosis.

Good idea. It would also be useful to ensure that insurance would not be available to those who were not so certificated and it was not legal to practice without insurance.

Jack