psychokinesis/psychic abilities

[curious]

I'm intermediate (i guess you can say, it's hard to weigh a skill like this against anything else) with PK. I was wondering if anyone else involved with these type of endevours saw rapid improvement. I've got some sticking points. I can't seem to get passed moving anything bigger than a toothpick and a toothpick still takes a bit of effort before I get it rolling. I'd like to become more fluid and possibly be able to do this in front of people, even heavy skeptics which are doing their own expert reverse PK ;p

[Tomo]

I'm intermediate (i guess you can say, it's hard to weigh a skill like this against anything else) with PK. I was wondering if anyone else involved with these type of endevours saw rapid improvement. I've got some sticking points. I can't seem to get passed moving anything bigger than a toothpick and a toothpick still takes a bit of effort before I get it rolling. I'd like to become more fluid and possibly be able to do this in front of people, even heavy skeptics which are doing their own expert reverse PK ;p
Are you saying that you can move something the size of a toothpick on demand with the power of your mind alone, without any other physical intervention either by yourself or another?

[Unregistered]

Have you ever done this in front of anyone? I think you may have put yourself accidently in a hypnotic trance which made you BELIEVE the toothpick moved.

[Tomo]

Have you ever done this in front of anyone? I think you may have put yourself accidently in a hypnotic trance which made you BELIEVE the toothpick moved. This was my initial thought, too. I remember a story on TV about a statue of the Virgin Mary that, if you stared at it, moved and Catholics everywhere were falling over themselves to have alook and declare it divine. Well, most things do wobble about if you stare at them for long enough.

I'm NOT doubting the original poster's sincerity at all, just curious as to whether it happens in the presence of others or whether he meant a self-induced hypnotic halucination.

[Merlin]

>I'd like to become more fluid and possibly be able to do this in front of people, even heavy skeptics which are doing their own expert reverse PK

As would everyone else who has attemted PK.

[Simple Guy]

Merlin,

What is your take on the spoonbending gatherings? (I've never attended one.)

[curious]

It's really not that big of a deal. There's a ton of people doing PK with success. Real success, not "hallucinations". And I have done it in front of two people: my mother and a psychiatrist. The psychiatrist was emotionless to it but within reason because I was demonstrating with a 'psi-wheel' which can be easily misconstrued for coincidence. Plus I didn't do it for long. It's hard with a skeptic. In front of my mother I did it fine, even under a glass jar.

psychokinesis forums: http://www.astralsociety.com/Forums/index.php?PHPSESSID=7e91f61eedd3787b2ef1e5f568c431 29&board=12.0

PsiPog: http://www.psipog.net

[Terry]

I would be inclined to ask," what has this got to do with hypnosis," except that in my day, I did experiments in the field of PSI using hypnosis on the volunteers (G)....Doubt that you will find much experienced interest in this area, and as for me, I was very successfull in OOBT and telepathy, but had no success at all with PK. Furthermore, many of those who made claims about PK were found to be frauds, so interest died rapidly.....Terry

[curious]

ok I'm not here to argue the valididity about what I DO, the valididity of PK. I just wanted to know if anyone experienced in it has benefited from hypnosis. Perhaps nobody in this community is, so be it. Thanks for your input anyway. I guess I'll try some visualization work.

[curious]

before anyone stomps me out, validity.

[Simple Guy]

Curious,

One of the largest hypnosis conventions had a spoonbending event, at least
twice, so maybe someone that attended this event can let us know what
their experience was. Any ABH convention atendees here?

[Merlin]

I don't know about 'spoonbending gatherings'.
PK is real and hypnosis can be effective at enhancing that skill like any other skill.

[Don]

I attended the event 2 years ago. My report of the event, along with example of my spoon bending, was eventually published in FATE magazine.

[Simple Guy]

Don,

I believe that I read your article when it was published. If I remember
correctly, there was a single photo of a bent spoon that accompanied
it.

Speaking of Fate magazine, there is a great cover from a 1954 issue
that can be found at: www.tranceworks.com/index.htm (http://www.tranceworks.com/index.htm) .

[Don]

There were actually several photos included. I felt the two that were most interesting were the ones where one of the tines of a fork didn't just bend back, but twisted as if someone had attached it to an electric drill. The other was of a thick spoon where the bowl, not the thin section or "neck" next to the bowl, bent in half. Neither bent "by itself," but they bent with me using almost no force at all. Quite a remarkable sensation.

[Unregistered]

can anyone tell me how to do it? I already know I have precognition but i wanna experiment with psychokinesis! I tried and once I got a little movement and I know it wasn't the wind because i was in my room(the object was the corner of my coverlet.

[Don]

Sure. You just put yourself in a mindset to do it, tell the spoon to bend, and it bends like butter. If you want to know more, go to the library and get some books on the subject. It takes longer than a few paragraphs to explain in detail.

Also, see http://www.jackhouck.com/pk.shtml

[The Mentalist]

Hey all, I've been reading on this after looking at the thread and it seems very cool. Here is a quote from a forum "let me put it this way: size and weight doen't matter, but only if you havent been thaught what we've been thaught for all those years. We always heard and saw that things were pulled down to the earth, and that there is gravity, and that a stone falls faster and is heavier than a piece of foil.
So TK is actually: "unlearn what you've learned." And your mind has to get used to it...when you start with the psiwheel your mind is like: oh well..this psiwheel could be moving by itself since its zo low-frictioned and light, and then you move on to a straw and a straw is also very light and could be moven by for example the wind. so it works this way if you been taught what I've been taught for all of these years. But If you are born, and since you are born you been taught that nothing is as it seems, and ytour parent show youy soo many times how to let the remote control fly towards you, THEN weight and size do probably not matter. Because your mind isnt conditioned and taught that this is impossible. And I believe that if you are very very far and experienced and you feel like your constantly one eith everything, when you really are somekind of guru or spiritual boeddhist or something:p I think then size and wheight doesn't matter anymore 2.
Then you "have seen the light" if you understand what I mean." To sum it up, its saying that if you truly don't believe something heavier would be harder to move, you can move it as easy as something very light, and I was thinking that hypnosis could make someone unlearn these concepts if that would be helpful? What do you guys think?

[kayimbo]

i can do minor pk, but i've gotten stuck. i'm learning to hypnotise myself now, so maybe in a couple months i'll let you know.

[The Mentalist]

how did you learn how to do it?

[curious]

wow this resurfaced.. I learned TK within 15-20 minutes of first attempt. Successfully, that is. I was using a psi wheel. For me this is a tedious length of time since I am very fidgety and perhaps that's why it seemed a resonable amount of time to 'let myself' do PK. I'm really starting to believe it's about allowing yourself to do things.

[Frog420]

Erm... am starting to doubt my mind completely now.... PK is real, telekinisis is real won't be long before someone here states they made a pig fly

or because people see it themselves they see it as real, because in their world it is real right? WRONG

[Merlin]

It's been said:

Do not try and bend the spoon
That’s impossible
Instead, only try and realize the truth...
There is no spoon

then you’ll see
that it is not the spoon that bends
it is only yourself

[Simple Guy]

Does anyone want to say with personal or scientific certainty that there
is no significant amount of pressure exerted upon the spoon, that in an
ordinary state of mind would not have also bent the spoon?

[Merlin]

After you have practiced and built confidence with spoons you can move to larger items, including steel bars so that there is no doubt in your mind :)

What is an 'ordinary state of mind'?

[Simple Guy]

Merlin,

"Ordinary" can be substituted with the state of mind of someone that has
not "practiced and built confidence" with spoons. Put otherwise, if there
were a gage measuring the pressure being exerted on the spoon, would
it be consistent with the amount that a machine could exert to similarly
bend the object?

[Jim'll Fix It]

Pk is 'real' , is there any actual evidence that a normal person could read/see/experience that would lead themselves to believe in such a feat of mental expression.
I personally find it very difficult to understand how others do 'achieve' such an improbable(in my model of the world) result.
I wish it were true,. how much fun could i have at work.? http://forum.hypnosis.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[Unregistered 4444]

Hi. I do belive that PK is real as I had a friend (when a teenager) who was able to do it for a short time. He could move plant leaves, pencils, capsules, etc. It was rather eerie and the motion always looked slightly unnatural. Not like something caused by wind. He stopped when a mutual friend told him the ability "came from Satan." If it was a trick, it seems unlikely he would have stopped from that warning.

Anyway, I'm writing to mention to PK'ers that the psi-wheel is a hoax. Rising micro-convection currents will cause it to spin. That's why it has the cut-outs. That's just physics. Challenge yourself by making one without the cutouts. Then you'll know.

P.S.-- Out of the blue, I had this very vivid dream in which I was in my bedroom at night and causing an object to move by PK. Since then, I have also started developing an interest and wondering if hypnosis could remove some blocks to PK. On the other hand, the dream could have just carried a symbolic message?

[savvy1]

Of all the brilliant minds that have blessed mankind, the people that claim the power of ''PK'' are surely the greatest. For you can move matter without physical intrusion!

Why not put your powers to use, maybe by returning our troops from iraq (help plug the deficit) when the time comes. Might need to benchpress some more toothpicks for that one.

[Russ]

Wow! Ohhh the possibilities.....I could turn my alarm clock off without moving.

I hate to sound like a total skeptic but, how far were you from the toothpick?

Ideomotor activity could create enough vibration to move a toothpick without directly touching what it is sitting on.

I'm going to teach PK to all children in America. The psycokinetic/telepathic energies developed by a 6 yr old kid focusing his powers for 4 hours a day, would greatly reduce the stress level of his parents. :-)

[Rain]

I have been trying telekinesis for couple of months and dont know whether im improving or not, i seem to make things move but dont know if i am actually doing it or it is purely coincedental??

[solaris152000]

"Do not try and bend the spoon
That’s impossible
Instead, only try and realize the truth...
There is no spoon

then you’ll see
that it is not the spoon that bends
it is only yourself"

Says it all really, for Tk to work you would have to bend your belief systems before you bent a spoon, in simple terms.

Dont Matrix quotes rule.

[Russ]

solaris152000>Dont Matrix quotes rule.


"I know kung fu"

[IAmKiko]

we're all average men...you can't do any pk/tk/stuff you say you can do...

its all a lie theres no such thing....ill meet santa claus before i see someone perform pk

[Sanity Clause]

Dear IAmKiko,

HO, HO, HO, MERRY CHRISTMAS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Love, Santa xxx

[teadaze]

curious,
The idea that PK actually works is brand new to me....I have been of the opinion that bending spoons was a magic trick.

I am always open to ideas though and I have been having a look around for more information. I found this website : http://home.xtra.co.nz/hosts/Wingmakers/Contents.html.

It is an free online training program teaching people how to build up psi abilities. if you read the later trainings, there is information on how to teleport your body!

I dont know what to make of it! Do you (or anyone) believe that any of this stuff is possible?

regards
teadaze

[teadaze]

oops :-)
just realised how old this thread was

[AnthonyM83]

Anyone who can do such tings want to check that website out (above) and let us know if it's legit? We have all kinds of open minds here, but we don't want to waste our time, either.

[Merlin]

>Do you (or anyone) believe that any of this stuff is possible?

any of which stuff?

[teadaze]

>>Do you (or anyone) believe that any of this stuff is possible?

>any of which stuff?


Psionics in general.

I spent some time yesterday making psi balls between my hands and just generally messing about...

macro-psychokenesis involoves moving objects....this is so bizarre to me - i've stopped trying to find explanations for it. Its tempting to assume that the people who do this are a bit crazy...
Can anyone direct me to any good books about this?

I know it is a bit off the subject of hypnosis. I may set up a new thread in the 'other discussion' section.

[teadaze]

does anyone think teleportation of your physical body is possible?
Check this out: step by step instructions of how to teleport!

http://home.xtra.co.nz/hosts/Wingmakers/Teleportation.html

..easy

[Merlin]

Teadaze,

I'm not sure what you mean when you use the word 'psionics'
'Psionics' isn't in my dictionary :(

[teadaze]

sorry...my mistake

okay (remembering that this is just based on what I read yesterday!), psionics are 'the powers of the mind such as telepathy, psycho kinetics, and clairsentience, used to create fantastic effects.'

a 'psion' is a person who 'actively practices and uses psychic abilities'

Im sure there are many names for what I am talking about. I will put a link up which gives a fascinating 'pdf handbook' for beginners of psionics:

http://www.psipog.net/thepsionshandbook01.pdf

[Merlin]

Ok, so:
Do you (or anyone) believe that any of this stuff ('the powers of the mind such as telepathy, psycho kinetics, and clairsentience, used to create fantastic effects') is possible?

Yes. Some of us do. Others don't.
There was a long discussion not to long ago when I said that I use the next winning lottery numbers as part of my final exam in the 'Remote Viewing' portion of my trainings.

The ability was dismissed when I would not produce numbers on demand as proof.

No one asked what kind of lottery, or how many hours of effort was being demanded of me.

So yes, there are some here with such experiences.

So far as I know though, psionic teleportation is beyond *current* _human_ abilities.

[rcs]

It's been said:

Do not try and bend the spoon
That’s impossible
Instead, only try and realize the truth...
There is no spoon

then you’ll see
that it is not the spoon that bends
it is only yourself

Matrix I believe...;)

[Merlin]

>Matrix I believe...

A+

[HypnoBear]

I'm reminded of a joke from comedian Steve Wright (addressing an audience):

"All those that believe in psychokinesis, raise MY hand".


For a rational look at the subject that cuts through the nonsense, click here:
http://skepdic.com/kinesis.html

[Don]

Respectfully, the so-called Skeptics (I have to admit that I get pissed off because they have appropriated and misused the term) do not offer a rational look at many subjects.

The entire idea of skepticism is that a person needs to see evidence before they make up their mnd on a subject. The various skeptical groups talk a good talk, but they do not walk their walk. Rather, they have made up their minds in advance and as part of their de facto religion, simply seek to debunk anything they don't believe in.

[Cassandra 8]

Respectfully, the so-called Skeptics (I have to admit that I get pissed off because they have appropriated and misused the term) do not offer a rational look at many subjects.

The entire idea of skepticism is that a person needs to see evidence before they make up their mnd on a subject. The various skeptical groups talk a good talk, but they do not walk their walk. Rather, they have made up their minds in advance and as part of their de facto religion, simply seek to debunk anything they don't believe in.Indeed, and ad hominem plays a large part in many sceptical "beliefs" on both sides.

I think this is why the scientific method is vitally important. You try to disprove your own theory about the world by experiment and data collection, rather than simply declaring it true. If, try as you might, you can't break your theory, you publish it and what you did to try to disprove it so that others can pick over it and try to break it too using experiment and data collection. If they can't and it's a repeatable effect, it's possible you've actually discovered something about the reality "out there" beyond our minds, but you must be a self-sceptic. That, I think, is a good use of scepticism. Perhaps the slogan on both sides of a debate into metaphysics should be "assume you're wrong and work backwards".

[Don]

The term "metaphysics" means "beyond physics." Rules for examining physical phenomena may not work in the study of the metaphysical.

Of course, some of those rules may not even work in the study of hypnosis. For example, if you come to hypnosis believing it won't work, and your hypnotist thinks hypnosis doesn't work, the results aren't going to be positive. Perhaps that's why two debunkers..er, self-styled "skeptics"--on TV recently came to the conclusion that hypnosis was a waste of time and money.

[Cassandra 8]

The term "metaphysics" means "beyond physics." Rules for examining physical phenomena may not work in the study of the metaphysical.

Of course, some of those rules may not even work in the study of hypnosis. For example, if you come to hypnosis believing it won't work, and your hypnotist thinks hypnosis doesn't work, the results aren't going to be positive. Perhaps that's why two debunkers..er, self-styled "skeptics"--on TV recently came to the conclusion that hypnosis was a waste of time and money.And no one from the other side of the argument? That's bad journalism. I have a sneaking suspicion the agenda was about what's nice to believe for the programme maker rather than finding truth.

[Merlin]

It's a cute joke.

Mocking the beliefs of others often gets a laugh.

It doesn't disprove anything though.

[Robert H]

Ever read "A Stranger in a Strange Land" ?

The author makes an interesting point....that if we somehow create or discover the model for PK - take the mystery out of it...make it as available as calculus ..... that it would turn the world on it's head...so to speak.

One of the ideas in "Stranger>>>" is that a group that could demonstrate mastery of psionics would be attacked hard by people from both the religious and scientific communities....and generally perceived as a threat.

Although according to The structure of scientific revolutions...Thomas Kuhn...that would all be part of the process of a global paradigm shift.

robert

[Merlin]

Robert,
That's a western paradigm.

In many Eastern countries it is a simple fact.
Something to be mastered as a skill.

[Robert H]

Merlin,

I'm curiuos which countries, and specifically the teachings or religions that take this as a fact. I, like many others, am somewhat interested in pushing the envelope in this area.

I know that in buddhism, yoga, hinduism, taoism, and shamanism pk is accepted. In these paths there are many cool things, however, I have not found yet many good strategies for PK.

That is my interest in the question - to find possible sources to model, even sources with vague or metaphoric descriptions. Sometimes the metaphors are precise recipes for the how of the siddhi's (psionic powers).

Do you, or anyone following this post, know of any such vague or metaphoric (or even better precise) descriptions of siddhis that can be construed as how to or descriptions of someones experience?

Thanks!!

Robert

[Cassandra 8]

One of the ideas in "Stranger>>>" is that a group that could demonstrate mastery of psionics would be attacked hard by people from both the religious and scientific communities....and generally perceived as a threat.Why science? After all, it would be keen to study and replicate such effects. Applications specialists would be keen to apply it. The military would look to science (as usual) to weaponise it. The public would hate it, the religious types would see their power base further slip away, but science would find it fascinating to study.

[Tha-Flash]

Why don't one of you take on the James Randi challenge, quite a bit of money: http://www.randi.org/research/challenge.html

[skip]

Not for someone who can actually do it.

[Don]

If you actually read the Randi "challenge," you would discover that only he decides if something is legitimate and no matter what happens, he is free to say anything he wants to about you, including lying, and you would have no legal recourse.

So with all the cards against you, only a fool would sign up...and from what I've seen, only fools or the naive have done so.

Why should anyone take his challenge, anyway?

[Terry (existing)]

Before doing any research into PSI, I spent a great deal of money and time preparing myself to do so. Once ready, I proceeded to carve my own path, since I had very little to direct me. But then, research by it's very intent, requires one to delve into the unknown, and test it. Unless you are willing to follow that same path, you will always remain curious, because you are not ready to know the facts. The researcher accepts nothing as fact until proven, but rejects nothing as impossible even if they fail to accomplish it themselves. Others ask questions but fail to follow up on the questions, so forever remain curious. If I told you I could make myself invisible, you would no doubt skoff and consider me off my head, so I ask you "WHY"? If I told you I could travel from here to the nearest planet or star in a matter of seconds, would you skoff, and if so WHY? If I told you I could fortell the future, would you believe me, or question my sanity? Why would you? I can tell you WHY but can;t change what is. The why is because you have never seen it done, don't have any reason to believe it can be done, and have no idea of who I am, or if I might be perhaps believeable, so my next question is also a "why" and it is "why are you wasting time asking? If you honestly want to know, do the work, or volunteer with someone willing and prepared to do the work.