View Full Version : Does this really work?
alphamind
03-11-2010, 10:25 AM
I recently came across the website XXX and saw stuff like using hypnosis to change your metabolic rate or even change your eye color. :daze:
Is it really possible?
Although the above post, which I edited to remove a link to a commercial website, reads like a sadly typical ad (do these sleezoids really think they're clever?), I thought people might like to discuss the issue raised by this first-time spammer, er, poster.
If the poster didn't mean to sound like a stupid advertiser, I apologize for the comment.
Connie
03-11-2010, 03:27 PM
Is it really possible?
Yes, and yes.
Poodle
03-11-2010, 05:29 PM
more than you could even possibly dream
sooooooo
Yes! Yes! and more than you can imagine. :cool:
The issue of eye color change has been discussed several times and if I remember well only Merlin stated she had success with it.
But I'm curious about the approach of brilliant hypnotist here about changes in metabolic rate. I remeber Merlin wrote about changing the self-image and Terry writing about leptin and it's role in the regulation of metabolism. Other approaches?
Very curious,
VIn
The other day I was reading the book "The word as a physiological and therapeutic factor" by Platonov and an interesting sentence caught my eye.
- K. Bykov suggests that "the mechanism of the influences of the cerebral cortex on metabolism, the ways in which these influences are effected, their significance (normal and pathological) are questions, the study of which has hardly begun and the answer to which may greatly surprise us" -
Vin
Poodle
03-14-2010, 04:19 PM
The issue of eye color change has been discussed several times and if I remember well only Merlin stated she had success with it.
But I'm curious about the approach of brilliant hypnotist here about changes in metabolic rate. I remeber Merlin wrote about changing the self-image and Terry writing about leptin and it's role in the regulation of metabolism. Other approaches?
Very curious,
VIn
We KNOW 100% for sure. Merlin is not the only person in the world with this knowledge. We know that people with multiple personalities often have eye color changes with the personality being presented and I have seen this in person. This means that very skilled hypnotherapists can easily change eye coloring. Way back, centuries and centuries, and centuries ago all humans had brown eyes. ONE LADY had a mutant gene and had blue eyes and it is from that one person that all the colors came into being. What do we know about Gene Expression Vin? :cool:
Pood :)
Well, at the time of the discussion only Merlin stated here that she has been successful, that doesn't mean others have been equally successful:).
I am well aware of people with multiple personalities having different eye color for each personality and this is somewhat confusing.
I mean, it seems, as you correctly pointed out, that a single mutation occurring 10,000 years ago was respoinsible for blue eyes, that seem to have been a sexual trait (a trait under sexual selection). But now, from people with MP, it seems that the expression of the gene responsible of eye pigmentation can be modulated.
By the way, I find equally interesting he regulation of metabolic rate, about which I'm still struggling (with clients).
Vin
Well, at the time of the discussion only Merlin stated here that she has been successful, that doesn't mean others have been equally successful:).
I am well aware of people with multiple personalities having different eye color for each personality and this is somewhat confusing.
I mean, it seems, as you correctly pointed out, that a single mutation occurring 10,000 years ago was respoinsible for blue eyes, that seem to have been a sexual trait (a trait under sexual selection). But now, from people with MP, it seems that the expression of the gene responsible of eye pigmentation can be modulated.
By the way, I find equally interesting he regulation of metabolic rate, about which I'm still struggling (with clients).
Vin
Poodle
03-14-2010, 08:02 PM
Stop the struggle and let the 'other mind' give you the answer. It's in there, I promise.
What you found from Terry is only one of the three. Can be curious as my Pilates Instructor also instructs Aerobics all day -- starting at 7am and classes finishing about 6pm. She still has energy to burn after all of this so in warmer months after 6pm she will mow lawns. I asked her how much she had to eat in one day just to stay her small adorable size. She eats more than three grown men combined. Yes, she is older but her body burns fuels at a tremendous rate do to what she does 5-6 days/week. The 7th day is clean house day.
Stay well and stay curious~Pood :)
Merlin
03-15-2010, 01:33 PM
But I'm curious about the approach of brilliant hypnotist here about changes in metabolic rate. I remeber Merlin wrote about changing the self-image and Terry writing about leptin and it's role in the regulation of metabolism. Other approaches?
Very curious,
VIn
define metabolism, change body temp?
Merlin
03-15-2010, 01:45 PM
could be, most just haven't tried eye colour change
define metabolism, change body temp?
The correct sentence is "metabolic rate" and not metabolism, in the sense of rate at which nutrients are used by the body. Poodle provided an interesting example, but it doesn't surprise me that a very active lady can eat like three people and be light as a bird. It's the physics diet (calorie in - calorie out). Phelps ate 12,000 calories a day and he is in a very good shape, isn't it? What would surprise me is someone eating like three people without an active lifestyle and with a perfect (very good shape) body composition.
Vin
could be, most just haven't tried eye colour change
Merlin, when you experiment with such things (for example eye colour change), when you satisfy your curiosity, do you start from your medical knowledge for your changing work? Gene expression? Adaptive responses?
Vin
Merlin
03-15-2010, 03:15 PM
Merlin, when you experiment with such things (for example eye colour change), when you satisfy your curiosity, do you start from your medical knowledge for your changing work? Gene expression? Adaptive responses?
Vin
no,
i just trust in the mind
Merlin
03-15-2010, 03:20 PM
What would surprise me is someone eating like three people without an active lifestyle and with a perfect (very good shape) body composition.
Vindoable
......
I have no problem in accepting it (it is doable). I'm in the stage after the "it is possible", that is, the stage "how does it work?".
Vin
Merlin
03-15-2010, 04:17 PM
I have no problem in accepting it (it is doable). I'm in the stage after the "it is possible", that is, the stage "how does it work?".
Vin
nothing mandates the absorbing of every possible calorie.
nothing mandates the absorbing of every possible calorie.
Well, it makes sense in evolutionary terms that absorption of nutrients is pretty much mechanic and its direction is toward the absorption of calories (it's much easier to eat a lot than to eat sub-maintenance).
So, there is a hormonal cascade subsequent (but many times anticipating also) ingestion of food/nutrients that is responsible for using/storing of nutrients. Physics diet work, as my grandmother said, people coming back from war (WWII) were not fat.
On the other hand, there are people, like "high strung" people, having metabolic rates far higher than normal.
Ok, what's the justification for the mind for not absorbing calories? Self-image?
Vin
Merlin
03-16-2010, 12:21 PM
next time you s---, save it.
put it outside. see if the unabsorbed nutrients attract flies.
>there are people, like "high strung" people, having metabolic rates far higher than normal.
no they don't.
they just move more.
>Ok, what's the justification for the mind for not absorbing calories? Self-image?
whatever the hypnotist says
parsa
03-17-2010, 09:49 AM
Fat cells can also die under certain circumstances.
There's actually two new techniques that's are currently being used for weight reduction but very limited, some FDA approval or something
Apparently fat cells die at some low temperature. So these people claim that their gizmo can do just this, kill fat cells with cold.
The other method breaks down fat cells and claims that it will lead to weight reduction.
This later one doesn't make sense to me within the current scientific model. The Sum rule for calories should mean that if the broken cells are not used up they'll reabsorb, but then if the body needs them why can't it just break it up itself?
So my conclusion would be that if this method does work, meaning participants don't actually start working out more and/or eating less, then it would mean that this time around the body is actually getting rid of the fat cells, as Merlin says is possible. So I don't know, I guess that would mean that your mind could do just this, breakup the fat cells and get rid of them.
And one other point. I 'm not sure when Merlin says all the energy doesn't have to be absorbed what she exactly means.
I would think that there are two possibilities. The excess energy of the chemical reaction from digestion is not absorbed and just joins the waist. Or just like gas or anything else that doesn't burn with the same efficiency every time, food doesn't have to either. All those chemical reactions can be inefficeint, hence less fat cells. I've seen an article on this too.
Merlin
03-17-2010, 10:10 AM
by the way, never tampered with self.
my eyecolour is naturally gorgeous :)
Merlin
03-17-2010, 10:52 AM
Fat cells can also die under certain circumstances.
There's actually two new techniques that's are currently being used for weight reduction but very limited, some FDA approval or something
Apparently fat cells die at some low temperature. So these people claim that their gizmo can do just this, kill fat cells with cold.
The other method breaks down fat cells and claims that it will lead to weight reduction.
This later one doesn't make sense to me within the current scientific model. The Sum rule for calories should mean that if the broken cells are not used up they'll reabsorb, but then if the body needs them why can't it just break it up itself?
So my conclusion would be that if this method does work, meaning participants don't actually start working out more and/or eating less, then it would mean that this time around the body is actually getting rid of the fat cells, as Merlin says is possible. So I don't know, I guess that would mean that your mind could do just this, breakup the fat cells and get rid of them.
And one other point. I 'm not sure when Merlin says all the energy doesn't have to be absorbed what she exactly means.
I would think that there are two possibilities. The excess energy of the chemical reaction from digestion is not absorbed and just joins the waist. Or just like gas or anything else that doesn't burn with the same efficiency every time, food doesn't have to either. All those chemical reactions can be inefficeint, hence less fat cells. I've seen an article on this too.
hi Parsa,
fat cells are like balloons filled with oil.
so, if you kill off some cells, then the remaining cells just fill up more.
in a car, all gasoline does not burn
some of it passes through unburned.
how much? variable
food can pass through undigested. how much? variable
parsa
03-17-2010, 11:17 AM
I see, so basically both methods don't actually work as claimed.
Was wondering,
aside from the body not using all the energy when it gets the food, can the mind decide to break down the existing fat cells and discard them as waste? Or will only do so when it needs the energy?
And,
If someone were to by hypnotized that they were running would they show all the physical attributes; using energy, sweating, getting warm, tired, muscle fatigue,...?
>there are people, like "high strung" people, having metabolic rates far higher than normal.
no they don't.
they just move more.
I have to disagree on this one. I have been into sports most of my life and I have seen athletes or pseudo-athletes :) in the thousands probably. With the same training and with very similar diets, there were big differences between people. If it is genetic, a carry-over effect from early life (see Dr. Gluckman for example, or myself :)), or unconscious non-genetic programming, I don't know, or better, I'm not sure.
Parsa,
it is fat mobilization + fat oxidation. Without oxidation there is no bye-bye fat.
It seems like there are two macro-options to weight loss (hypnotically):
1. eating less or eating better (do we really need professional guidance to know what eating better means?)
2. calories unabsorbed
I was reading some time ago the beatiful book about the starving experiment by Ancel Keys andthe experiment is a standard answer to people claiming "I cannot lose weight" (there are other similar examples). So dietary manipulation works, apart from big pathologies, but option two is far more interesting. I bet more difficult for the uninitiated.
Poodle
03-17-2010, 07:55 PM
This methodology has been used by hypnotherapists in the USA with some very good results. We have a foundation that the mind controls the body and we know that to be true as we are pretty much unaware of all our bodily functions. The 'mind' helps the complete digestional tract to absorb only what is needed to maintain optimal health which also includes energy. It's like being on a diet without a diet. Yes, people will still have to remain physically active so skin can reabsorb back to it's original shape. Many that have gone thru the medical way of gastric by-pass/lap band surgery render humans unable to eat more than a tiny, tiny little paper cup of a food. The weight comes off waaaaay tooooo fast so they have to have plastic surgery to get rid of all the loose skin. More often than not they are also left anemic. In hypnotherapy we make the changes very gradually and the clients do have to exercise one way or another. We prefer no more than four pounds/week maximum and if it exceeds the four, we have to readjust. Weight loss with hypnotherapy is not a one trip and it's done. We have to constantly monitor clients.
We also have ways of hyponotic 'exercising' that are very strange to the remainder of the world. The mind does it with a 'trigger'. This is the type of work we do not post 'how to's' here as there are too many DIY'ers that read this Forum. It was a gift given to some of us from Terry so we could continue carrying out his magnificent work.
I have personally had clients with absolutely no knowledge whatsoever about nutrition.
Connie
03-17-2010, 08:43 PM
Know what? I don't need to know the "science" and jargon behind a healthy body to put these changes into motion, such as an increased metabolism. The unconscious knows. Far far far far better than I know, than the client knows, than medicine knows, than science does. All I have to do is make the suggestion to take place in a healthy way for the person to acheive the healthy and well-formed desired end result. Accent on healthy. And accent on well-formed. All my work with clients is based on a well-formed outcome.
It's not complicated, or overly specific. I don't tell these enzymes to do that, or this bla-bla to do hee-haw, I don't have to name the chemicals and dissect what happens in the body. That seems stupid! And unnecessary. It's simple (and effective) the way I put it all into play. I call it: trust the unconscious. To do what's best for the person in the best way, or not at all when appropriate.
Connie,
I understand you point of view, but I see nothing wrong in discussing something about changing in terms that go over the unconscious mind or the mind knows best. Going over in the sense of what happen next. So, how does the "hypnotic suggestion" work here? You know, in the specific case, the "scientific" diet works. Indirect manipulation of hormonal activities, calorie balance etc. And it works to modulate the percentage of fat (just to say a measure) anywhere. If you stick to it, you've got it. If you want to have a decent shape (not an athlete shape, for instance), there is a simple recipe, eat less, move more. And you know, it works. Wonderfully.
I am not discussing the validity of the hypnotic approach, I'm an hypnotist myself. But I see nothing wrong in trying to understand how things work, what are the effects of the hypnotic intervention on the metabolic machinery. Enzimes, hormones, receptors, and so on are not items invented by science. And I see nothing wrong in understanding the machinery. And I'm very curious about the effects of hypnotic intervention here.
Merlin
03-18-2010, 12:48 PM
I see, so basically both methods don't actually work as claimed.
Was wondering,
aside from the body not using all the energy when it gets the food, can the mind decide to break down the existing fat cells and discard them as waste? Or will only do so when it needs the energy?
fat cells?
it does so daily
and replaces them
remove stored fat?
yes
throw away stored fat? doable.
And,
If someone were to by hypnotized that they were running would they show all the physical attributes; using energy, sweating, getting warm, tired, muscle fatigue,...?yes
...................................
hopefully we are not discussing actual weight loss methods, just discussing how it works.
we are discussing micro-management.
it's best to tell the mind your desired outcome and let it decide the how-to
Merlin
03-18-2010, 01:05 PM
one thing to keep in mind.
all that fat has to be transported through the blood system.
so, not to fast... slow weight loss is best
>We prefer no more than four pounds/week maximum :)
Merlin
03-18-2010, 01:09 PM
yes Connie, you're right.
too many people micro-manage the process with bad results.
Merlin
03-18-2010, 01:22 PM
Indirect manipulation of hormonal activities, calorie balance etc. And it works to modulate the percentage of fat (just to say a measure) anywhere.
which is fine if you know about such things.
most MDs don't:eek:
it's a complex cascade of hormones.
parsa
03-18-2010, 04:43 PM
Thanks guys :).
Questions just out of curiosity, no intention of taking the process apart and using it piece by piece, not that I think I could :);).
Connie
03-18-2010, 05:04 PM
...I see nothing wrong in trying to understand how things work, what are the effects of the hypnotic intervention on the metabolic machinery. Enzimes, hormones, receptors, and so on...
I don't see anything wrong in that, either! I just don't care about it! :) AND, it's not necessary to successful work. If it's interesting to you, go for it, developing that understanding. If I wanted to be a physician, I'd have done that.
I feel that too much "rule and rigamarole" gets in the way of a lot of healing--including hynotherapy and including energy work. Intuition is MY unconscious, and I really trust it.
yes Connie, you're right.
too many people micro-manage the process with bad results.
Merlin, in my posts I was trying to discuss how it works, not to suggest the client to reduce/increase cAMP activity or stop gluconeogenesis to preserve muscle mass. I hope it was clear.
which is fine if you know about such things.
most MDs don't:eek:
it's a complex cascade of hormones.
Well, most MDs don't have a clue about a lot of things. And do have a lot of clues about other things. What is learned during general courses is easily forgotten. But, every MD once knew that ingestion of carbs has a strong causal relationship with insulin production. And that leptin has a central role in the regulation of metabolic rate. And that body tries keep maintaing homeostasis. And that the second law of thermodynamics hold true even if we talk about our bodies.
Finally, we all understand that if you eat less, you tend to lose weight.
I don't see anything wrong in that, either! I just don't care about it! :) AND, it's not necessary to successful work. If it's interesting to you, go for it, developing that understanding. If I wanted to be a physician, I'd have done that.
I feel that too much "rule and rigamarole" gets in the way of a lot of healing--including hynotherapy and including energy work. Intuition is MY unconscious, and I really trust it.
Can knowledge impair work? Or a little knowledge is a dangerous thing?
I'm sure there isn't anything wrong in learning, maybe in applying:) (you are, Connie).
I think that "if I wanted to be a physician, I'd have done that" is a little bit simplicistic.
Vin:
If I wanted to know how a car works, I would be a mechanic.
If I wanted to know how to grow plants, I would be an agronomist.
If I wanted to know how to save money, I would be an economist.
If I wanted to know how to make love, I would be a pornstar.
I hope you all notice the logical fallacies in my statements, but it is fun, isn't it? Does professionalization ruin the joy of discovering?
So, let me expand, just for fun:
Client: I really want to lose weight, but I cannot.
Me: Did you apply the universal rule?
Client: What?
Me: Eating less and moving more. Do that, it works.
Do we really need hypnotherapy/energy work/NLP and so on?
Isn' it too much "rule and rigamarole"?
parsa
03-19-2010, 06:17 AM
>>one thing to keep in mind.
all that fat has to be transported through the blood system.
so, not to fast... slow weight loss is best
So what about people like professional athletes or the Pilates instructor Pood mentioned? All those extra calories they take in still has to go through the blood stream to get to where it's needed.
Connie
03-19-2010, 05:18 PM
Vin...the proof is in the pudding.
Does NLP and hypnosis work? Well, what I know for sure is that when I do it, it works magnificently. Re: weight loss. I'm an expert. My body is an expert. After a lifetime of struggling with weight without these tools, upon finding them: I'm one half the size I used to be, and I'm helping numerous clients to just as dramatic changes in their lives. And I don't give a fig about the scientific details behind fat-burning. Fancy that!
Poodle
03-19-2010, 09:41 PM
I did have one male client that knew zero about nutrition. He had never been exposed to it. His parents were very, very poor and he was doing good to get a peanut butter sandwich -- I'm sure you can 'see' where this is going (or went).
Anyway, just to make gosh darn sure I did buy him a 'good-bye' present. A nice book about different foods and nutrition. Lord, you would have thought I gave him the world.
He really didn't need it. He had naturally found himself eating less and for some strange reason wanting fruits, veggies and things he had never eaten before. He also found that he had more energy with less of him so he started out going on walks, etc., etc., etc. He was very, very pleased about his grocery bills that got smaller right along with him.
I certainly did not see any scientific stuff in what Terry did sooo very successfully for all of his life until he decided to 'retire' and switched to cancer cures. I bet you read exactly what I read.
Hugs~Pood
Vin...the proof is in the pudding.
Does NLP and hypnosis work? Well, what I know for sure is that when I do it, it works magnificently. Re: weight loss. I'm an expert. My body is an expert. After a lifetime of struggling with weight without these tools, upon finding them: I'm one half the size I used to be, and I'm helping numerous clients to just as dramatic changes in their lives. And I don't give a fig about the scientific details behind fat-burning. Fancy that!
Connie, I did not say they don't work, it was very clear.
Your post is very clear and interesting as usual, but I asked if we need that for weight loss, not if it works and it is a completely different question.
Enzymes (just to name one) are not a scientific detail, what is scientific in an enzyme? Or in a cell? Or in a brain? Science is a way of discovering, meditation is a way of discovering.
I'm sure you are having wonderful results, but it was not the point, never was.
I did have one male client that knew zero about nutrition. He had never been exposed to it. His parents were very, very poor and he was doing good to get a peanut butter sandwich -- I'm sure you can 'see' where this is going (or went).
Anyway, just to make gosh darn sure I did buy him a 'good-bye' present. A nice book about different foods and nutrition. Lord, you would have thought I gave him the world.
He really didn't need it. He had naturally found himself eating less and for some strange reason wanting fruits, veggies and things he had never eaten before. He also found that he had more energy with less of him so he started out going on walks, etc., etc., etc. He was very, very pleased about his grocery bills that got smaller right along with him.
I certainly did not see any scientific stuff in what Terry did sooo very successfully for all of his life until he decided to 'retire' and switched to cancer cures. I bet you read exactly what I read.
Hugs~Pood
Poodle,
thanks for the interesting story.
I have never seen anybody switch from "I don't care about food, I eat all the junk I can" to "I'm very interested in nutrition, I like collecting books about recipes". This is one of the main reasons why conventional diets fail. A lot of overweight people are not caring about food, they care about eating. In fact, going on with the usual unaccurate generalization, people with serious weight issues are not bon vivant, while the slightly overweight doesn't care about losing weight.
And while I don't know the details of Terry's work, I think that saying that is nothing scientific (that doesn't mean is antiscientific, actually there is nothing antiscientific, only non-scientific) I don't know what it means (actually I know, but it has nothing to do with science).
Merlin
03-22-2010, 12:20 PM
are we talking high strung, or athletes?
Merlin
03-22-2010, 12:43 PM
hi vin,
my comment was only to connie's post
are we talking high strung, or athletes?
Merlin, I was talking about people of the "nervous" type. But it is not only limited to athletes or particular people. Different people have different metabolic rates (not induced by exercise).
Poodle
03-25-2010, 09:23 PM
Merlin. I love the combination of red with green. Terry LOVED red with brown. :) What can we say? Reds have it made. :cool:
I was reading lately about metabolic set points and they can provide a good explanation of why changing the self-image can provide changes in metabolic rates and other things. I found a good accordance between this theory and the anedoctical evidence provided by Maltz in his Psyco-cibernetics (a wonderful book, by the way). Now, it would be interesting to know how far we can go.
Vin
It's interesting how my readings are bringing me back here.
From the book "Switch" by Heath and Heath (nice book, btw):
"Couldn't it kick your metabolism into overdrive or something?
It's not impossible, we suppose, but let's be honest: If the power of thinking could indeed make you skinnier, that would be a scientific revelation on par with cold fusion (as well as a billion-dollar self-help book - Think Yourself Thin)."
Anyone willing to go on par with cold fusion?:D
Vin
Merlin
04-29-2010, 12:14 PM
If the power of thinking could indeed make you skinnier...
welcome to reality
Vin,
If someone loses weight deliberately, how exactly, do you think they did it?
What deliberate method, do you know of, that does not involve thinking and believing it can be done?
skip
Skip,
I read this sentence in the book and I thought it was interesting to report. I also think the book is fairly interesting for fellows involved in changing work.
When you say, if one wants deliberately to lose weight, he/she has to think and believe it can be done, I think is not 100% true, one needs to eat less (or absorb less, as Merlin said) than it's caloric expenditure (up to a certain point).
Do you have to think about that? Sure (think about what, when and how much you need to eat). Think it can be done? I think I can get caught in a trap with the word deliberately, so I pass on.
Do you have to believe? Only if you need to believe to take action, you can also take action without believing it can be done.
What is interesting (relative to the cold fusion example) and has been discussed, is that you can lose weigth without restrticting calories (in a general sense, and this includes activity) and viceversa.
I am really interested in that approach as I usually use another one and the last time I tried that I did not have good results.
Vin
OK so you parroted the question without having thought it through.
Who among us hasnt done that?
NOW having given it some thought ...
I used deliberate, to avoid such situations as losing weight because of sickness, or depression, or some such.
If I understand you correctly, someone can deliberately lose weight without thinking about and believing their selected method will work...
How or why do you suppose they would deliberately (as opposed to accidentally) implement a method they neither thought about nor believed would work?
skip
OK so you parroted the question without having thought it through.
Who among us hasnt done that?
NOW having given it some thought ...
I used deliberate, to avoid such situations as losing weight because of sickness, or depression, or some such.
If I understand you correctly, someone can deliberately lose weight without thinking about and believing their selected method will work...
How or why do you suppose they would deliberately (as opposed to accidentally) implement a method they neither thought about nor believed would work?
skip
Skip,
did I parrot your question?
"I used deliberate, to avoid such situations as losing weight because of sickness, or depression, or some such."
Also simple, easy, effective caloric restriction (deliberate or not)?
"If I understand you correctly, someone can deliberately lose weight without thinking about and believing their selected method will work..."
Deliberately in the sense of intentionally? Yes, no problem for humans, it is normal, in the sense of frequent, to select a method without thinking and believing it will work. When we say, "I will try", we don't think and believe it will work. In the context of weight loss, if you restrict calories enough, you will lose weight, even if you don't think and believe it will work, but simply say "I will try".
Now, optimal weight loss, expenditure, normal functioning ("The great starvation experiment" is a great book to understand what food deprivation can cause to human behaviour) require additional thoughts.
I hope I answered your question.
Vin
Didnt parrot my question Vin, you said you got it from a book and repeated it without thinking about it (parroted).
I believe you are 'seeing' right past the obvious. If that is the case, you certainly wouldnt be the first.
So if I understand your last "When we say, "I will try", we don't think and believe it will work.", you are indicating that we are willing to undertake things even when we do not believe we have a chance at succeeding.
What was the last thing you undertook with that understanding?
Recognize here Vin, that I do not believe any of us undertake tasks we havent given some thought, and or believe in some chance (however slim) of success. Otherwise we wouldnt put forth the effort.
So I am interested in the last thoughtforsaken, hopeless, task you have undertaken.
For example why did you undertake it?
cheers,
skip
Skip,
I carefully thought about it.
The first part of the sentence from the book that I reported in the previous post is something along the line of "could you kick your metabolism into overdrive by simply thinking about it?"
So, no increased energetic expenditure, no diet modifications. So, I did not see past the obvious (you have to think and believe).
I think, but maybe I'm wrong, that you did not intepreted the sentence this way, as your comments suggest otherwise.
But your comments are interesting as usual.
"you are indicating that we are willing to undertake things even when we do not believe we have a chance at succeeding".
Yes, for example peer pressure.
"and or believe in some chance (however slim) of success. Otherwise we wouldnt put forth the effort".
"However slim" is critical here. If you believe that belief is fuzzy, I think that believing 0.1% (whatever it means) is drastically different from believing 60%.
As for a personal case, a couple of weeks ago I had to resubmit a paper, one of my co-authors suggested a modification I did not approve. Due to contingenties, I accepted the modification, even if I did believe 0% it could help us. I could say no, due to contingencies I said yes. We are open systems, so isolation is not possible. Does it fit into? Maybe. Do not know.
However, main point is that I was not seeing past the obvious, I was commenting what the Heath and Heath wrote.
Vin
Poodle
05-03-2010, 12:34 PM
Bff was told by MD she HAD TO LOSE WEIGHT! He said 1200 calories/day and was told to walk around her block once/day for some exercise. She thought she was going to starve on 1200 calories/day. She has now lost the 20 pounds the MD wanted and is now going for 20 more which is her personal goal. She had no idea how much food 1200 calories/day really is. I don't even get close to that amount. Always before her conversations with me were about FOOD -- we went out to dinner at ... and I had ... or when on vacation .. we stayed at this fabulous motel and they had their own chef so I could order exactly what I wanted and I wanted it...taking mother out to eat ... taking in-laws out to eat. Let's go out to lunch. ALL WAS FOOD! We now have interesting conversations and if she mentions the words about 'food' I just say stop it. When we go out now it's for a nice glass of ice tea and some good friendly chatter.
She is firm in her belief that she will never do this to herself again in this lifetime and is totally amazed at how much she can really eat on 1200 calories. To date there has been no walking. She wants to blame weight gain on smoking cessation; however, in fact, she was close to that size when she quit and a bit late on that score too as she has COPD and oxygen 24/7/365.
I'm pretty sure most members posting here know about the MD/patient relationship. ; -)
I would not work with her on this because she is my bff and I could never take money from her so it would have been a zero value for her. We did work on the previous chemo treatment and she did amazingly well...not sick/ill once. She also did not lose one pound with chemo.
Pood