Confused

[thebizzarreone]

I've recently been considering hypnotherapy but am confused about certain aspects. I've heard many success stories and a couple of non successful stories. What i've seen is that when the clients issue is analysed and attempted some kind of change there is nearly always a positive result. However many of the clients who claim the therapy did not work say all the therapist did was teach them how to relax.

Are there two types of hypnotherapy - relaxation being one and resolving the issue being another?

Sorry if this thread doesn't make much sense, it was just a question I am wondering.

Thanks,
thebizzarreone.

[Poodle]

Please read Merlin's FAQ regarding hypnosis. I'm sure it will answer your questions. Relaxation is not hypnosis but can be a lovely by-product of it. Around these parts what you are writing about is termed "Relax-o-therapy".

If after reading the FAQ, you may feel free to post more if you have more questions.

Be well,
Pood

PS: Confusion is a great state as it is just on the edge of understanding.

[Merlin]

There is hypnosis and relax-o-therapy sometimes called hypnosis.
see my FAQ

[thebizzarreone]

Thanks boys. They didn't exactly term it as "relax-o-therapy" but they said something along the lines of "it didn't work for me, all they did was teach me how to relax" which I suppose is the same thing.

Well that has cleared up some of the confusion so thanks. How can I be sure to get a hypnotist and not someone who is just going to teach me how to relax?

Thanks,
thebizzarreone.

[Don]

TBO, that you for your question. Personally, I think it is a good one!

Others may disagree with my comments, but at least it will be a start.

One of the benefits and challenges to hypnotherapy is that it is not regulated in the U.S. As a result, there are many different styles of hypnosis and hypnotherapy. Most--but not all--hypnotherapists learn several different techniques. Hypnotherapy, by it's nature, is not like lining up to get a flu shot where everyone gets the same thing. Each client is seen as a unique person entitled to unique work from the hypnotherapist. By studying many systems, a hypnotist can choose exactly the right one for a client.

Contrast this to psychology where most psychologists specialize in one treatment system and must push and pull to get their patients to fit into their paradigm. [Hypnotherapy is client oriented. Psychological therapy tends to be process oriented. Psychiatry, today, tends to be drug oriented.]

If it were not for this lack of regulation, all of these different "schools," "systems," or "techniques" of hypnotherapy would not have developed. Therefore, the lack of regulation has been of great benefit.

On the other hand, there are various organizations that give "weekend wonder" trainings, where you get a good dose of the basics thrown at you over the course of a couple of days. These courses are often fantastic--as beginning and introductory courses. I've taken them, appreciate them, have learned from them and value them.

Unfortunately, these courses often imply (or outright state) that a person who takes them now knows everything to be a hypnotherapist and go into business. Generally, because it is easy to use and teach, such courses limit themselves to what is known as a "progressive relaxation induction." There's not enough time to really help a student practice observing whether a client is actually in a hypnotic trance. IF they are able to get a person into a trance using that system they also learn enough to get started in what, for many hypnotists, is their "bread and butter," smoking cessation and weight normalization.

If someone starts out trying to practice after a weekend wonder workshop, he or she is likely to quickly learn that they have much to learn. However, some people don't "get it" at all. That progressive relaxation leads to, well, relaxation but not necessarily hypnotic trance. That may be what those people who claim all they did was learn how to relax experienced.

There are people practicing their trades in all fields, from plumbing to dentistry, who are not very good.

There is another possibility. In most states in the U.S., hypnotherapy is a complementary healing modality. If someone has received a medical diagnosis from a licensed medical professional and goes to a hypnotherapist, the hypnotherapist in most states may not legally help the client with that issue without a written referral from the MD. So what the hypnotist might do is tell the person to obtain a referral, and in the meantime, teach the client relaxation techniques as stress often compounds many issues.

So there is not a simple answer to your question. But here, in brief, is a summary.
1) There are many schools of hypnotherapy with different techniques. Most experienced hypnotists know several.
2) Some hypnotists who have not had extensive training may only know how to do progressive relaxation inductions and basic suggestion techniques.
3) If a person has received a medical diagnosis, in most states a hypnotists may not work with that person for that issue without a referral from a licensed medical professional. In such a case, the hypnotist may teach relaxation techniques to a client until such a referral is received.

The results of this information should lead you to the next question: How do you know if a hypnotherapist has received training in several systems and is experienced? The solution: ask!

[Don]

Shh! Don't tell anyone. Both Poodle and Merlin are women! :eek: :D

[thebizzarreone]

Thanks Don, Merlin and Poodle. One more thing, is there anything I should look for when looking for a good hypnotherapist as i'm not sure if hypnotherapy is regulated or not in the UK.

Thanks,
thebizzarreone.

[Terry]

Relax o therapy? If we split hypnosis into two parts, we have training in "Induction", the easy but nescessary part of putting the client into a state where therapy can be applied. This is of course taught to the weekend wonders, and they get the impression that this is all there is to hypnosis. The hard part, studying the minds of others, and recognising both the differenced and the similarities among people, and learning how to use the clients mind to effect required change, now that is not taught in any classroom, it can only be started there, and then constant practise, and development of understanding takes many years before a practitioner can consider themselves among the best. For some things, being the best is not a requirement in order to give the client what they want. As Don says, helping the client lose weight can be done by rote almost, and takes little time to become accomplished at. However more serious problems require much more knowledge, and this is were you separate the men from the boys, and the girls from the women...
So you see, though we flippantly speak of Relax o therapy, it really isn't therapy at all, since little more is done than put the client into trance and tell them to relax, which is enough if all you want to do is get a good nights sleep, but hardly therapy.
As for any other advise, I suggest you ask for certain things in writing. Things such as number of trainings, and from whom. How many years in practise etc. Why in writing? Because a con artist will rarely put something in writing that can be held against him later, and because contrary to some who offer such advise, asking for the name of a client they have recently dealt with is not smart. The ethical practitioner will never divulge the name of a client without their permission, but will divulge personal information as I have suggested, and do so without hesitation. Other than that, note how you feel in the presence of the therapist, because if you are not comfortable they are not for you no matter how good they are..
In spite of my number of years in practise, I have had prospective clients decide that we are not a good fit, and that is fine, since feeling that way, I would have been wasting my time trying to help them, and would preffer they find someone more compatible....

[Jack]

Thanks Don, Merlin and Poodle. One more thing, is there anything I should look for when looking for a good hypnotherapist as i'm not sure if hypnotherapy is regulated or not in the UK.

Thanks,
thebizzarreone.

No it is not regulated in the UK. However, there are a few organisations which demand accredited training to have taken place as a condition of membership, further supervision during the first few years of practice and a set number of hours of CPD each year to ensure continuing membership. These organisations will also have a complaints procedure, a written code of ethics and an ethics comittee. In the UK, the National Council for Hypnotherapy is in my opinion the most professional, probably because I am in it.:)

As for relax-o-therapy well, I disagree with most of the previous posts.

Physical relaxation is not necessary for that altered state we term 'hypnosis', but as Poodle say it is a pleasant adjunct to it.

However, mental relaxation is necessary. By mental relaxation I mean the bypassing of the conscious part of the brain to access the subconscious. Without that access hypnotherapy is just talking at someone with their eyes closed (or open).

Sometimes, a client will relax both physically and mentally, or one or the other. An experienced hypnotherapist can tell which is which and will act appropriately. With a nervous client an hypnotherapist may very well use physical relaxation techniques since these allow the client to feel more comfortable with the process, and occasionally a client might enter 'hypnosis' without anything other than soothing words. If that is 'relax-o-therapy' then count me in - I could not give a flying fig how a client gets into and hypnotic trance, only that they get there so we can address whatever they have come to see me for.

However, most of the time physical relaxation is not necessary, but dismissing it as a mechanism is foolish, simply because it can be useful. You know, I sometimes use odd bits of poetry to induce a trance, and still use a bright shiny object if I think that is what a client will respond to. Sometimes I use nothing other than a simple one line command and the client achieves a deep altered state within a minute or so.

So, my advice to you is to call around a number of properly qualified hypnotherapists in your area, and find someone with whom you feel comfortable on the 'phone. Forget about what techniques they might use to enable you to experience an altered state and concentrate on what you are going to get from the experience.

After all, if you hire an electrician you want to know that he is properly qualified, but you don't usually need to examine his screwdriver.;)

Jack

Qualified as a Master Relax-o-Therapist in 1965 when I hypnotised my cat.

[Simple Guy]

Just as a follow-up to my friend, Jack's comments on relaxation,
people can relax if finding themselves relaxed and in the care
of an expert hypnotherapist. The work gets done, though, when
physically relaxed, or otherwise. First responders often encounter
people in less than relaxed conditions, and without training, their
words and actions have more consequences than they are aware.
"Debriefers" and counselors can do more harm than good, if they
don't recognize "trance" signs and respond accordingly and properly.
I'm not going to parse this out. Knowledgeable people here will know
what this is about.

[pmdigi]

to bypass the critical factor without relaxing it? What about a "confusion" technique kind of induction?

[Simple Guy]

Hi Pmdigi,

Yes, a confusion induction, that is done without a subsequent/concurrent
physical relaxation taking place, would be an example. In such a case,
though, the critical factor isn't really being relaxed as much as wearied.

[Jack]

to bypass the critical factor without relaxing it? What about a "confusion" technique kind of induction?

Good point, pmdgi. A good indication of what us happening during a confusion induction is when 'the moment of passivity' is achieved a client will visually, physically and suddenly relax. This may be reflected at the mental level, but we have no way of knowing that to be true, (except perhaps through EEG readings) and personally I don't care overmuch since induction is merely a mechanism to reach a place of change.

However, I make a presumption that something has relaxed enough to enable me to get to where I need to be. Again, I'm not really concerned with what label is attached to it, critical factor or whatever, only that the client is subconsciously receptive.

So, if we call it weariness or relaxation then I'm comfortable with that. We could probably call it 'sausages' if we wanted to. My point was that as hypnotherapists nothing should be thrown away which has a real or potential use. 'Relax-o-therapy' is one such.

Jack

[Terry]

Good point,

So, if we call it weariness or relaxation then I'm comfortable with that. We could probably call it 'sausages' if we wanted to. My point was that as hypnotherapists nothing should be thrown away which has a real or potential use. 'Relax-o-therapy' is one such.

Jack
I bought some sausages once that were so relaxed that when I fried them they fell out of their casings... Perhaps they were confused by the heat.:)

[Jack]

I bought some sausages once that were so relaxed that when I fried them they fell out of their casings... Perhaps they were confused by the heat.:)

LOL! Don't think I want to know how relaxed your sausage was, Terry:)

Jack

[thebizzarreone]

LOL! Don't think I want to know how relaxed your sausage was, Terry:)

Jack

Lol my sausage is very relaxed :p

[Simple Guy]

Jack, Terry, Thebizzareone,

Now, you're not going to get me to participate in this adolescent
"sausage" talk by musing over the possible origin of the British name for
a kind of link, the "banger."* No, not me. ;)

* I've no idea why it is called a "banger."

[Terry]

Ah yes, bangers and mash. loved it.....The greasier the better.....

[Terry]

It is called a "banger" because when cooked at high temperatures as suggested for all pork products, the skins burst with a loud pop. Now , get your mind out of the gutter you naughty boy, and pay attention to this mine of information on the vaguaries of English terminology as it is used in various parts of the UK. All done without the use of a refference book, just from memory......

[Simple Guy]

Hi Terry,

Is that right? :) I don't cook pork sausage very often (largely switched
to very high quality turkey sausage), but have been stringent about
well-done pork because of trichinosis concerns. About cooking
sausage, when I bake up a large quantity, I quell hunger
pangs by putting a couple of links in a cast iron pan and flattening
them right out of their skins, to cook them up crispy and rapidly.

[Jack]

Terry is absolutely right with regard to the origin of the word 'banger' although some time ago, the glorious European Union wanted to call the 'umble British sausage a 'fat filled bag' to please the Germans whose sausages have a higher percentage of actual meat.

This was resisted strenuously as memories of fighting various people on various beaches, Spitfires at dawn and cries of 'tally-ho, chaps' resounded throughout the tabloid press and pubs of the land.

FYI there are some genuinely disgusting mass produced sausages which are filled with fat, besides genitals, ears, eyes (and eyelids) hooves and ani(anuses?). But there are some genuinely splendid British sausages filled with the finest venison, organic beef, pork and herbs and spices that rival any food in the world. Personally, I enjoy the Duke of Devonshire's Venison sausages from the Chatsworth Estate in Derbyshire which a friend who lives close buys for me. Although I resent filling the coffers of an already wealthy bunch of aristocrats, I do so like the sausages, but will say nothing about the necessity to give one's sausage a good pricking to prevent untoward explosions.

And what about Lancashire and Yorkshire Black Pudding, Terry? Dried pigs blood with globules of fat fried in yet more fat and tasting absolutely delicious with a good heart-bursting English breakfast....ahh, the old days when my doctor was not so concerned about my health.

Back to the damned muesli.

Jack


Hi Terry,

Is that right? :) I don't cook pork sausage very often (largely switched
to very high quality turkey sausage), but have been stringent about
well-done pork because of trichinosis concerns. About cooking
sausage, when I bake up a large quantity, I quell hunger
pangs by putting a couple of links in a cast iron pan and flattening
them right out of their skins, to cook them up crispy and rapidly.

[Terry]

Ah yes, blood sausage, and memories of a youth spend in ignorance of the damage I was doing to my health....:D Imagine eating raw sausage, raw liver, and of course the inimitable blood sausage in the days of no fridge, no protection from contamination by flies etc, and damn it, we will likely live longer than those who have been wrapped in a cucoon of protection from all bugs and viruses except those they get on their computer, and who will never work as hard as we, so will likely die of obesity and their bodies will last for eons because of the chemicals inside them...:eek:
Not a prediction of course, just an observation. I still eat things my children and grandchildren turn up their noses at, and still experiment with foods. Yesterday I spent part of the day cooking ham and pea soup so thick it won't pour out of the pot.... What was that old nursery ryhme?
Peas pudding hot, peas pudding cold,
Peas pudding in the pot nine days old.
Some like it hot, some like it cold,
But I like it from the pot, nine days old....;)

[thebizzarreone]

In America i understand sausages are called weiners. Would anyone like a bite of my weiner? :p

[Merlin]

I'd be happy to fry it up for you.

[Terry]

In America i understand sausages are called weiners. Would anyone like a bite of my weiner? :p Wrong, sausages are still sausages and weiners are a totally different entity. Put the two side by side and the difference is obvious....

[Poodle]

is, of course, very correct. Weenies come from cattle. Sausage is from pigs. It is also sold already cooked so all one has to do is heat it up in the microwave. Actually, they both are now.

Those white things in blood sausage are actually fat? I always thought it was some type of a grain product. Oh well. Still alive and living well!! Would like some for supper.

Pood

[Jack]

It always surprises me how, as one gets older and such things become evident, the friends who die first are those who eat vegetarian and exercise regularly.

Of course the statistics say differently, but I wonder in whose interests the statistics are prepared?
Thinking about it further, perhaps I don't.

Jack

[Don]

Eat well.
Exercise regularly.
Get plenty of restorative rest.


Die anyway.

[Merlin]

There are many other considerations, often ignored.
People are not bio-machines.

[Merlin]

>>In America i understand sausages are called weiners. Would anyone like a bite of my weiner?

>Wrong, sausages are still sausages and weiners are a totally different entity. Put the two side by side and the difference is obvious....

Then there are weenies.
But we let them post anyway.

[Jack]

There are many other considerations, often ignored.
People are not bio-machines.

I agree. Otherwise they would last longer with regular servicing.

Jack

[Don]

I agree. Otherwise they would last longer with regular servicing.

Jack

I am fully in favor of being regularly serviced. :eek: :eek: :eek:

[Jack]

I am fully in favor of being regularly serviced. :eek: :eek: :eek:

Terry has a spare sausage.:D

Jack

[thebizzarreone]

I am fully in favor of being regularly serviced. :eek: :eek: :eek:

I'm serviced every night :p

[Connie]

In honor of this topic, I had a hot dog for lunch. :)

[Simple Guy]

Connie,

Now, you are making me hungry. I've got some great mustard
and some nitrite/nitrate free hotdogs would be a good excuse
to use it. I never understood why anyone would want to put
ketchup on hotdogs -- doing so is about as mystifying as our
British friends who might put milk in their tea (not saying you'd
do either such thing).

[Simple Guy]

The Bizzarreone,

Did you ever get a sufficient answer to what you asked about
in the starting post in this thread?

[Jack]

doing so is about as mystifying as our
British friends who might put milk in their tea (not saying you'd
do either such thing).

Well SG one should always have milk in black tea, to do otherwise is both barbaric, un-Christian and absolutely non-u. One should never have milk in green tea for the same reasons. One should only drink black tea from Assam, Darjeeling or Ceylon since women pickers in other regions of Asia lack the sensitivity of the aformentioned and bruise tea leaves when they are picked and cause a bitter taste.

I only know this because my Great-Aunt Margaret told me so when I was eight, and she knew everything.

She would have considered the idea of a hot-dog close to obscenity.:D

Jack

[Connie]

http://cachens.corbis.com/CorbisImage/170/14/56/02/14560202/CRB001681.jpg

Try it, you'll like it! :) I don't like relish, however, or onions, just straight mustard! No milk in tea for me, that wouldn't be "tea-like." Tea is a clear liquid, not a milky colored liquid.

[thebizzarreone]

I did jack yes. I would like to ask one more question if I may; is a cobination of both hypnosis and nlp more effective at treating a particular problem that on their own?

Thanks,
TheBizzarreOne.

[Simple Guy]

The Bizzrreone,

I'm not Jack, but will answer. A combination of hypnosis and NLP
may or may not be more effective at treating a particular problem
than "on their own." It depends on lots of things including the skills
of the practitioner in either or both hypnosis and NLP and the
particular person and problem. There are some people, who, at
higher levels of practice do incorporate aspects of both, anyway,
and may call their work NLP or hypnosis.

I hope this helps. I'd personally not get caught up in labels were
I seeking a great practitioner, just someone who can get the job
done. :)