Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind

[Joel]

Hello,

I've been interested in hypnotism my whole life and am now considering entering the profession but a lingering problem remains in my mind concerning why people seek it and what some hypnotists seem comfortable providing.

A hypnotist on Youtube offers a "Previous relationship memory eraser" to get rid of all those "good memories that just drag you back" while a local hypnotist nearby offers a "guilt eraser". There's a thread on the board concerning someone who wanted to use hypnosis in order to eliminate their sexuality as it was becoming inconvenient. Its like rather than dealing with their problems and experiences many seem to want to just erase large chunks of who they are.

How prevalent is this sort of thinking? Does anyone else get a major "Ick!!" reaction from it?

Is there something here I'm missing?

[Don]

Hi, Joel, and welcome. I hope you will post frequently.

If you check our archives, you'll find that people want to "just forget something" quite often. There are several reasons for this.

The primary reason is that they don't understand the workings of the mind. The secondary reason is that they have false ideas about what hypnosis can and cannot do.

So a large part of hypnotherapy consists of explaining these things and giving positive alternatives. Specifically, taking away the negative impact of memories or behaviors that are "inconvenient" and helping a person remember without the negativity (so they won't accidentally repeat the action that caused the negative emotions) and achieve desirable levels of behavior.

Welcome to the profession!

[Poodle]

and welcome. You will do wonderfully in your course as you are already sorting out the good from the not so good.

Please join in and post more. :)

Pood

[Connie]

Hi, Joel! Welcome! You can be one of the sensible/ethical practitioners. :)

[Merlin]

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c344/Myhrrhleine2/welcome/welcome.gif

So glad you're here!
We hope we can help you be successful.
There are some people in business to help others.
There are some people in business to help themselves to other's money.
both are on the Internet.

Please read my FAQ for a starting point.

Next, http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c344/Myhrrhleine2/welcome/post.gif

[Joel]

Thanks for your replies everyone.

I see the value in reframing (I think I'm using the term right) a negative experience. If someone is depressed than pointing out the positive value of the depression in pointing out a problem and encouraging someone to change and then leading that emotion through to a more positive state is how it should be done. Like, "Emotion teaches us, love teaches us to value those around us, fear teaches us not to jump off planes, depression is no different, its just a signal to us that we can become happier by changing our thoughts and actions...."

Wow, what a bad example eh?

Anyway, is that basically what your communicating to me here?

If so I agree, an approach that says, "Let's simply erase the experience and the emotional impact" isn't healthy. Using it to motivate a new way of thinking is.

[Don]

Hi, Joel.

Well, I have to disagree with you. I don't point "out the positive value of depression." Nor do I use depression to "motivate a new way of thinking."

"Depression," as a term used in therapy, has a specific meaning...or rather is a term that covers a wide set of behaviors. For example, spending excessive time sleeping is a sign of depression. But then, insomnia is also a sign of depression.

If a term can mean (or in this case, indicate) both X and not-X, then the term, without context, is meaningless. So if someone says "I'm suffering from depression," one of my first goals is to learn what the client means. Once I discover the behavior(s) the client classes as "depression," I help the client change those behaviors. When he or she is no longer doing the things they call "depression," they are no longer depressed.

They may talk about depression, I deal with behaviors. I can't end what is described by the meaningless term "depression," but I can help people change behaviors from unwanted ones to desired ones.

In the case of someone wanting to forget a past experience, erasing it and its emotional impact, I'll point out that the problem is not the experience, it's the emotions attached to the experience. There is a reason for people to have a strong emotion based on a past experience, and in my practice, the client is unaware of that reason. Therefore, by allowing the client to learn the reason, he or she will no longer need to have that emotional impact. So my goal is not to "motivate a new way of thinking," but rather, it is one of self-discovery. It is to help a person get the learnings they have not realized, keeping the emotions about the experience on a sharp edge.

A side-effect of obtaining the learnings is often a new way of thinking, but that is a beneficial side issue, not the direction where I focus.

You will learn all of this and more when you start training to be a hypnotherapist!

[Soren K (existing)]

"Let's simply erase the experience and the emotional impact" isn't healthy. Using it to motivate a new way of thinking is.

I got to wondering here, does reframing erase experiences? I might say 'yes' when I say - 'it's not the same', but then what is not the same? I've a lot yet to learn, I feel. :cool:

[Simple Guy]

Hi Soren,

A reframe of an experience doesn't erase it, but changes the light
in which it is seen.

[Poodle]

There are different kinds of reframing. One in NLP is the 6-Step Reframe and then there are also "content" reframing - changing meaning or context.

It's in the B&G book "Reframing". It starts out with Leslie Cameron-Bandler working with a lady that is a "clean" freak and cannot handle anyone walking on her carpets - person steps on carpet, she gets out vacuum to get rid of footprints. So Leslie has the lady close her eyes and visualize the carpet without any footprints and the lady is super happy. Then Leslie says: "and realize fully that that means you are totally alone and that the people you care for and love are nowhere around." The lady didn't like that statement so Leslie had the lady put a few foot prints on the carpet so the lady would know that the people she loved were nearby. The stimulus didn't change but it's meaning did. That's a reframe. Some changes can be that fantastically simple.

The book, IMO, starts out really great, then goes down hill, then gets back up to good again. You should be able to find the book on Amazon or equivalent. If you want the NLP 6-step I'll e it to you.

Hugs~ma

[Merlin]

The experience is not negative or positive.
It simply is.
We then rate the experience good... bad... wonderful... aweful... etc.
What if we change the criteria for the rating?
What if we change our values for rating?

[Poodle]

a different signature line. True. Experience just is and we are the meaning makers of our experiences.

[Soren K (existing)]

the B&G book "Reframing".

Thanks Ma, i got a copy of it (had two in fact - just gave one away to my kid's mother). However, I've not got onto it yet (I read the foreword and it said it presupposes familiarity with Frogs into Princes - so I'm still spending time on Frogs into Princes, which is really most excellent. I'm current on Chapter 2, and also spending time on Patterns Vol 1, and Structure of Magic 1 (I'm really studying those titles just now - very complimentary of one another in a lot of ways, and truly excellent). I never sit down with Patterns volume 1 where I don't sit down reading writing and thinking through it and the feeling wells up in me 'oh ho ho, this is really really really good stuff' (and I regularly feel that aaah <pointing finger up> feeling when lots of stuff fits together - really cool title. I'll get to reframing yet! I'm taking my time with these titles though as I think they are very important and want to integrate them as much as possible while I'm working on them. Bandler's got a few more new titles coming out later this year I believe - including RB's guide to Trance-formations: hypnosis for everybody - should be good!


If you want the NLP 6-step I'll e it to you. That'd be cool Ma, look forward to it!

Yours truly,
JC :)

[Soren K (existing)]

Hi Soren,

A reframe of an experience doesn't erase it, but changes the light
in which it is seen.

I see what you mean.

Another question then, how do you tell the experience from any number of its modifications? I was amazed when I was able to invent a memory as real as any other - indeed the only thing left to distinguish it as having not genuinely happened is that I remember having invented it! Perhaps that is what saves the experience itself over its reframe - but when you invent a memory as real as any other, it's as real as any other (weird). I'm not yet sure if I wonder how easily such an instantiator might itself be concealed, perhaps I'll contemplate that sometime.

Cheers,
Soren
:)

[Don]

That's why it's especially important for people to be trained in forensic hypnosis before trying to help people recovers "real" memories. If a hypnotist doesn't know what he or she is doing it becomes very easy for a person to invent past events and actually believe they are real.

[Simple Guy]

Hi Soren,

Memories do become modified as people go about life and it can
be difficult to distinguish an actual event from its modifications.
Don spoke of forensic hypnosis -- there were lots of people damaged
by psychologists who had their own reasons and some insufficiencies
of training -- "False Memory Syndrome."

Wishing everyone lots of good memories, to be created from
well-lived lives, from this moment forward.